Sorcer with high critical dmagae atacks

WhiteTigre

How does one build Sorc with high level critical attacks ?. I am struggling so much to get my crits up.

I have heard a vr6 sorc having over 50% spell crit damage. is that possible ?

Septimus_Magna

You can get to 57% quite easy once you're vr12. I have 3x Aether (8% spell crit), 3x soulshine jewerly (4% spell crit) and 3x Twilight (4% spell crit), 6% spell crit on staff plus undaunted 2-set. I like the engine guardian but you can go daedroth or nerien for extra damage. And I use the thief mundus stone for 5% extra crit.

Armor sets: 22%
Light armor passives: 10%
Inner light: 20%
Thief: 5%

Total: 57% spell crit

MADshadowman

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

You can get to 57% quite easy once you're vr12. I have 3x Aether (8% spell crit), 3x soulshine jewerly (4% spell crit) and 3x Twilight (4% spell crit), 6% spell crit on staff plus undaunted 2-set. I like the engine guardian but you can go daedroth or nerien for extra damage. And I use the thief mundus stone for 5% extra crit.

Armor sets: 22%
Light armor passives: 10%
Inner light: 20%
Thief: 5%

Total: 57% spell crit

How viable is this build? What other set bonuses come with the pieces? How's the sustain? Tested in pvp?

WhiteTigre

then survivability skill because sorc are so weak in hit point ?

Tankqull

MADshadowman wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

You can get to 57% quite easy once you're vr12. I have 3x Aether (8% spell crit), 3x soulshine jewerly (4% spell crit) and 3x Twilight (4% spell crit), 6% spell crit on staff plus undaunted 2-set. I like the engine guardian but you can go daedroth or nerien for extra damage. And I use the thief mundus stone for 5% extra crit.

Armor sets: 22%
Light armor passives: 10%
Inner light: 20%
Thief: 5%

Total: 57% spell crit

How viable is this build? What other set bonuses come with the pieces? How's the sustain? Tested in pvp?

other set boni are 77+ magicka and 9 spelldmg
in pvp its currently completly useless and that doesent change much with 1.6 even with the changes to impen.

Septimus_Magna

There might be some confusion regarding pve and pvp builds. Pve builds work great with spell crit, they dont work well in pvp because everyone has high crit resistance and surviving is more important.

For pve I would advise high spell crit with crit surge for extra damage and self heals. The well known crushing shock build works really well.

For pvp I would advise high magicka cost reduction and spell damage build. You need sword and board for defensive posture imo. In big groups I use a destro staff for aoe damage, in small groups or solo i use a resto staff for self helaing. I have seducer + arch mage + cyrodiil's light sets. Deltia has a good pvp sorc build called revamped frag out or something.

Gyudan

Best sets for lots of crit:
- Twilight's Embrace (3 pieces): 4% spell crit (crafted)
- Wise Mage (3 pieces): 8% spell crit (Aetherian Archive)
- Infaillible Mage (2 pieces): 4% spell crit (Sanctum Ophidia)
- Soulshine (jewelry, 3 pieces): 4% spell crit (VR10 PVE zone)

With those sets you get +20% spell crit.

As a sorcerer, using Shadow mundus boon (and not thief!), I reach 67% spell critical with the PVP buffs and without potions.

Alternative setup:
- Wrath of the Imperium (3 pieces): 10% spell crit
- Wise Mage (3 pieces): 8% spell crit
- Infaillible Mage (4 pieces): 4% spell crit

With those sets you get +22% spell crit, but you lose 1 useful set piece.

Stannum

encase or rune prison = +15% crit

Septimus_Magna

Encase is not very useful in my experience. For the magicka cost I rather use 2 more impulse for more aoe damage.

Regarding the shadow or thief mundus, either one is a solid option. But I prefer thief because crushing shock does 3x damage per attack so the value of each hit is relatively low. I have tried both and didnt see a significant difference but the thief increases the number of self heals so that why I sticked with the thief. Also razor caltrops scales of weapon crit so its nice to have some weapon crit when you use razor caltrops.

WhiteTigre

What would one recommend to build spell damage as opposed to spell crits ?
Is spell dmage better than spell crits ? or do they work together beter as opposed to individual builds of spell damage and spell crit

Septimus_Magna

WhiteTigre wrote: »

What would one recommend to build spell damage as opposed to spell crits ?
Is spell dmage better than spell crits ? or do they work together beter as opposed to individual builds of spell damage and spell crit

Right now spell damage doesnt affect destro staff skills, this changes in update 1.6 btw. But destro staff does scale off spell crit so spell crit is currently the best way to increase dps with destro staff. Spell damage is better for pvp because many people have high crit resistance and you can rely on burst damage instead of sustained dps.

When update 1.6 goes live, there will be a balance between spell damage and spell crit because destro staff uses both to calculate its damage. High spell damage also gives higher critical hit damage so you probably should have both. Right now you need 3 spell damage or 2% spell crit to increase damage by 1%.

Stannum

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Encase is not very useful in my experience. For the magicka cost I rather use 2 more impulse for more aoe damage.

Different playstyles. Encase is may be best CC for large area cover. I prefer to keep up shattering prison and elemental blockade and sometimes thundering presence casting elemental ring eventually then to use pure impulse spam. Cause after nerf impulse covers rather small area. And if your magika gets low you can use only shattering prison and elemental blockade and have time for heavy attacks so your magika is endless.

MADshadowman

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

WhiteTigre wrote: »

What would one recommend to build spell damage as opposed to spell crits ?
Is spell dmage better than spell crits ? or do they work together beter as opposed to individual builds of spell damage and spell crit

Right now spell damage doesnt affect destro staff skills, this changes in update 1.6 btw. But destro staff does scale off spell crit so spell crit is currently the best way to increase dps with destro staff. Spell damage is better for pvp because many people have high crit resistance and you can rely on burst damage instead of sustained dps.

When update 1.6 goes live, there will be a balance between spell damage and spell crit because destro staff uses both to calculate its damage. High spell damage also gives higher critical hit damage so you probably should have both. Right now you need 3 spell damage or 2% spell crit to increase damage by 1%.

This is not true. Max magicka and spell power have quite some influence on destro and resto staff abilities. Plus they boost your class spells, so it's overall better to go for a high max magicka and spell power instead of weapon damage.

MADshadowman

WhiteTigre wrote: »

What would one recommend to build spell damage as opposed to spell crits ?
Is spell dmage better than spell crits ? or do they work together beter as opposed to individual builds of spell damage and spell crit

Spell damage is always better than spell crit. Cause your crit chance is only a chance, whereas your damage applies to every attack. It's better to pack more damage in your regular hits, than to hope some of your attacks will crit.

MADshadowman

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

The well known crushing shock build works really well.

What's that well known crushing shock build? Did i miss something?

Thelon

I've developed a very popular Crushing Shock Build on Tamriel Foundry.

Hope you like it!

MADshadowman

Thelon wrote: »

I've developed a very popular Crushing Shock Build on Tamriel Foundry.

Hope you like it!

Hmm... not usefull for me, sorry.

Joy_Division

MADshadowman wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

WhiteTigre wrote: »

What would one recommend to build spell damage as opposed to spell crits ?
Is spell dmage better than spell crits ? or do they work together beter as opposed to individual builds of spell damage and spell crit

Right now spell damage doesnt affect destro staff skills, this changes in update 1.6 btw. But destro staff does scale off spell crit so spell crit is currently the best way to increase dps with destro staff. Spell damage is better for pvp because many people have high crit resistance and you can rely on burst damage instead of sustained dps.

When update 1.6 goes live, there will be a balance between spell damage and spell crit because destro staff uses both to calculate its damage. High spell damage also gives higher critical hit damage so you probably should have both. Right now you need 3 spell damage or 2% spell crit to increase damage by 1%.

This is not true. Max magicka and spell power have quite some influence on destro and resto staff abilities. Plus they boost your class spells, so it's overall better to go for a high max magicka and spell power instead of weapon damage.

Nope. Spell damage as of right now has ZERO effect of destruction and restoration staff abilities. None. Until 1.6, these abilities are tied to weapon power.

Septimus_Magna

MADshadowman wrote: »

WhiteTigre wrote: »

What would one recommend to build spell damage as opposed to spell crits ?
Is spell dmage better than spell crits ? or do they work together beter as opposed to individual builds of spell damage and spell crit

Spell damage is always better than spell crit. Cause your crit chance is only a chance, whereas your damage applies to every attack. It's better to pack more damage in your regular hits, than to hope some of your attacks will crit.

Well thats just not true, max magicka/spell crit/weapon damage determine the damage of destro staff abilities. You can see the modifiers on this page: Destructive Clench Also with 60% spell crit you do more critcal hits than normal hits and they do 50% more damage, so which would be better?

MADshadowman

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

MADshadowman wrote: »

WhiteTigre wrote: »

What would one recommend to build spell damage as opposed to spell crits ?
Is spell dmage better than spell crits ? or do they work together beter as opposed to individual builds of spell damage and spell crit

Spell damage is always better than spell crit. Cause your crit chance is only a chance, whereas your damage applies to every attack. It's better to pack more damage in your regular hits, than to hope some of your attacks will crit.

Well thats just not true, max magicka/spell crit/weapon damage determine the damage of destro staff abilities. You can see the modifiers on this page: Destructive Clench Also with 60% spell crit you do more critcal hits than normal hits and they do 50% more damage, so which would be better?

Your 60% will not give you more crit hits than normal hits on targets with impen, which is very widely spread in cyrodiil. In pve this might work, but i can easily pull 1200-2000 dps with only 10% crit chance in pve too. I prefer spell power over crit chance cause i want my spells to hit hard no matter if they crit or not.

WhiteTigre

Your 60% will not give you more crit hits than normal hits on targets with impen, which is very widely spread in cyrodiil. In pve this might work, but i can easily pull 1200-2000 dps with only 10% crit chance in pve too. I prefer spell power over crit chance cause i want my spells to hit hard no matter if they crit or not.[/quote]


How do you augment spell power

Septimus_Magna

MADshadowman wrote: »

Your 60% will not give you more crit hits than normal hits on targets with impen, which is very widely spread in cyrodiil. In pve this might work, but i can easily pull 1200-2000 dps with only 10% crit chance in pve too. I prefer spell power over crit chance cause i want my spells to hit hard no matter if they crit or not.

Like stated before, spell crit is for pve. Spell power for pvp due to the inpenetrable trait. When I say dps I'm talking about single target sustained dps for longer than 60 seconds, not 6 target aoe burn all magicka type dps. There is no way you do 1200 dps single target with 10% spell crit for 60 seconds. Your class spells hit hard with a lot of spell power true, but weapon skills like destro staff abilities arent affected by spell power in any way.

Why do you think crit surge increases destro staff damage when it increases weapon power? And why would people use the flawless dawnbreaker ultimate which passively increases weapon damage by 13%?

Here is some proof I actually know what I'm talking about, my single target dps (1167 dps) and aoe dps (2786 dps).

Dracane

And you totall forget, that you can't crit against blocking targets or targets with damage shields, no matter how high your crit chance is. So spell damage is better here.

Septimus_Magna

Dracane wrote: »

And you totall forget, that you can't crit against blocking targets or targets with damage shields, no matter how high your crit chance is. So spell damage is better here.

Because bosses in dungeons and trails are always blocking and have a damage shield up? You can have 1000 spell damage but if you only have 50 weapon damage your destro staff abilities will hardly do any damage.

Please show your damage (single target damage for 60 seconds) staticitcs with spell damage build to prove me wrong.

DeLindsay

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Because bosses in dungeons and trails are always blocking and have a damage shield up? You can have 1000 spell damage but if you only have 50 weapon damage your destro staff abilities will hardly do any damage.

Please show your damage (single target damage for 60 seconds) staticitcs with spell damage build to prove me wrong.

For a few more weeks that is. Once 1.6 is Live Destro will scale off Spell Damage. And to agree with your above post, there's no way the other poster is doing 2K ST DPS on a Sorc with 10% Spell Crit.

A bit for the OP, once you are over 50% Spell Crit (without Theif Mundus) you should run Shadow Mundus for higher DPS. Usually this takes 4pc Aether from Trials to push well over 50% without Thief, or constant PvP buffs. Without 4pc Aether, I'm at 54% using Thief with no Cyro buffs and a mix of Epic/Legendary gear for my DPS set on my NB. But I also Heal so I keep Thief for that.

Gyudan

@Septimus_Magna‌: I see no light attacks in your FTC report. You need to learn how to weave/animation cancel, that would significantly increase your DPS. Also, try power surge instead of critical surge, you'll see a large improvement quickly as well.

Septimus_Magna

Gyudan wrote: »

@Septimus_Magna‌: I see no light attacks in your FTC report. You need to learn how to weave/animation cancel, that would significantly increase your DPS. Also, try power surge instead of critical surge, you'll see a large improvement quickly as well.

Its better to weave slightly charged attacks and they are registered as heavy attacks. And ofc I weave with animation cancelling so thats something I dont have to learn. I have no problem with magicka so crit surge works better for me because of the huge self heals while dealing damage. I heal myself for 380 per second with single target damage and 1440 with aoe damage, as long as I have magicka Im quite unkillable for normal mobs.

Power Surge probably will be better for destro staff in 1.6 but I have to try it tonight on PTS.

Dracane

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

And you totall forget, that you can't crit against blocking targets or targets with damage shields, no matter how high your crit chance is. So spell damage is better here.

Because bosses in dungeons and trails are always blocking and have a damage shield up? You can have 1000 spell damage but if you only have 50 weapon damage your destro staff abilities will hardly do any damage.

Please show your damage (single target damage for 60 seconds) staticitcs with spell damage build to prove me wrong.

I'm only talking about pvp and regular damage.
Only uncapable fools can't sustain in PvE.

Septimus_Magna

Dracane wrote: »

I'm only talking about pvp and regular damage.
Only uncapable fools can't sustain in PvE.

Well the OP asked for a sorc build with high critical damage, viable for pve NOT for pvp (which has been stated numerous times). PVP is an entirely different game, you need different sets and skills to be effective in both, especially for sorcs.