Play the way you want?

zaria

kongkim wrote: »

Or being excluded from trials as you have a summon pet in your skill bar....

Many people find a build they like to play with and don't play around with 30 other skills. I do understand that you can come if you are tanky and there is need for DPS.
But many time people get excluded fore not having the build others think is the best.

And that is annoying.

The pet is awesome for solo play, not very effective in group play as its main purpose is tanking.
None would exclude you from trial if you showed up with the pet as long as you changes you skillbar before you start.
During trials I always change the bar multiple times during the run depending on the situation, this is also something you do in dungeons after wipes.

kongkim

zaria wrote: »

kongkim wrote: »

Or being excluded from trials as you have a summon pet in your skill bar....

Many people find a build they like to play with and don't play around with 30 other skills. I do understand that you can come if you are tanky and there is need for DPS.
But many time people get excluded fore not having the build others think is the best.

And that is annoying.

The pet is awesome for solo play, not very effective in group play as its main purpose is tanking.
None would exclude you from trial if you showed up with the pet as long as you changes you skillbar before you start.
During trials I always change the bar multiple times during the run depending on the situation, this is also something you do in dungeons after wipes.

Yah i know. but that is the whole point here. That trails force you to change your build and skill to what others say to get into a trail.

Elsonso

thomas.k.grayb14_ESO wrote: »

Think of your gear/build like a resume for people who haven't played with you before. They don't know you or what you are capable of and when you show up to DPS in heavy armor, well, that speaks volumes. The people you are trying to group with want some assurance that they can rely on you to do your part, they don't want to strap on back-braces and carry you through an instance

So, a better system would be one that lets you know how experienced the player is, regardless of what the character looks like. Right now, people areevaluating the player based on how well the character conforms to prejudicial builds. Maybe a better measure would be an indication of the history of the player and the character, not the DPS and combat numbers, that would better match people together with like-skilled players.

Zorrashi

xMovingTarget wrote: »

Zorrashi wrote: »

The tank/heavy armor dude could have had the best skills in the game that gave him among the highest survivability/damage rate for his build, but I don't expect most trial groups to give him the chance to prove it.

There´s no need to prove. The best player cant do it. You simply cant pull off decent DPS with 1h/shield in heavy armor. Its just not possible. Same person could just switch to medium armor and dualwield, then he can go DPS.

You guys need to get out of your one Role if you struggle with it. All the Tanks in my Guild or friends i do dungeons etc with have a DPS set. So they can go from tank to DPS very quick.

In this game you can be everything on 1 character. To a certain extend of course. But even DPS Templars are viable. If we have enough healers but more than enough templars, we let do damage. No big deal. We even get through Sanctum with dps temps.

Just be flexible. Helps you alot in this game with getting into content

That was actually just a very-very-very-rare-possibly-not-even-existent hypothetical. I don't expect that build to pull off a decent dps that is acceptable for VR dungeons and trials.
I was trying to express how his dps may be passable (not readily acceptable but passable) for groups doing normal dungeons, which are significantly toned down in difficulty from their VR counterparts.

Like, how is he supposed to know that he is likely going to fail in those higher level dungeons unless he experiences failure in at least the lower ones? Nothing is more frustrating and irritating at being kicked/excluded rom a group and you have little clue as to why.
And, in the off chance all he wants to do is experience content, I at least say that he should experience the low-end stuff....he may have to figure out a different build/setup if he ever wants to move beyond that stuff though.

Gilvoth

in dungeon and dragons online mmo, they allow anyone to purchase hirelings to help you through the dungeons. so anyone can play solo if they wish it.
i wish elderscrolls online did the same, would be awesome!
i prefer solo play with hirelings instead of group.

mazrimtaimxpreub18_ESO

lordrichter wrote: »

thomas.k.grayb14_ESO wrote: »

Think of your gear/build like a resume for people who haven't played with you before. They don't know you or what you are capable of and when you show up to DPS in heavy armor, well, that speaks volumes. The people you are trying to group with want some assurance that they can rely on you to do your part, they don't want to strap on back-braces and carry you through an instance

So, a better system would be one that lets you know how experienced the player is, regardless of what the character looks like. Right now, people areevaluating the player based on how well the character conforms to prejudicial builds. Maybe a better measure would be an indication of the history of the player and the character, not the DPS and combat numbers, that would better match people together with like-skilled players.

Sounds strange but I think experience does not prove anything. Being an experienced player means that you should probably have already figured out that Heavy Armor and Shield does not work for a DPS role... but it is not always the case.

Take two players and say one ran through a dungeon and it took 30 minutes and the other player spent 4 hours wiping in the same dungeon and the group had to disband. I would not look at the two and assume the guy who wiped for 4 hours has 8 times the experience as the guy who took 30 is better because he has more "experience."

I have a friend that started playing this game rather late. He made a DPS character and then grinded ASAP to VR14 (took him about a week). He approached the game with an open mind and learned how to DPS and he completed Vet DSA with us with only a few weeks of experience. He has blown through every Vet Dungeon as well not because he has experience, but because he learned how to DPS with the class he plays and understands that when you are in a group your role becomes more specialized then if you are playing solo.

In Short: DPS Meter is a better indicator of knowing how to DPS then hours logged into the game in my opinion.

mazrimtaimxpreub18_ESO

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

in dungeon and dragons online mmo, they allow anyone to purchase hirelings to help you through the dungeons. so anyone can play solo if they wish it.
i wish elderscrolls online did the same, would be awesome!
i prefer solo play with hirelings instead of group.

@dwemer_paleologist‌ - Please don't take offense as I certainly don't intend any - but why exactly do you play MMOs if you do not like playing with other people? There are a ton of great solo RPGs out there (especially TES games).

kongkim

mazrimtaimxpreub18_ESO wrote: »

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

in dungeon and dragons online mmo, they allow anyone to purchase hirelings to help you through the dungeons. so anyone can play solo if they wish it.
i wish elderscrolls online did the same, would be awesome!
i prefer solo play with hirelings instead of group.

@dwemer_paleologist‌ - Please don't take offense as I certainly don't intend any - but why exactly do you play MMOs if you do not like playing with other people? There are a ton of great solo RPGs out there (especially TES games).

This is the newest Elder Scrolls game. Nye stories new places to see and explore. When they made the game they said they were trying to get both groups og players and not just make another mmo like any other out there.

Its a good game but im mainly here for the TES game and not the mmo. But with that said i do enjoy the other people and guilds and trading alot

Jitterbug

PBpsy wrote: »

AshySamurai wrote: »

AngryNord wrote: »

Rosveen wrote: »

What in the world possessed you to queue as a dps in full heavy with a shield?

My guess is it was the wording, "Play as you want". I might be mistaken, of course.

IMO play as you want doesn't mean that you can do all you want (like have high dps with s&b). It means if you want to have more survivability, you can use s&b regardless of your race or class. If you want to have more dps, you can use other weapon. And you can freely switch from one role to another.

One of my favorite aspects of the game is how well this game actually achieves what you just said. It is amazing how easy one can move from doing different roles. The game offer a lot of flexibility but "the play the way you want" is too often interpreted you can be as stubbornly rigid as you want

Yeah a lot of people read "play as you want" but see "win regardless of how you play"

jacktors11

You cannot blame a game company for the a bunch of fickle players. My suggestion is to join a dedicated guild, not just for selling your goods. Join a guild where you can make friends, develop online relationships, and learn the trials and dungeons together. Trying to join a pickup trial, raid, dungeon in ANY mmo will get you the same results. No matter what game you choose, you will find this type of ridiculous player that is all about their own play time, and nobody should slow them down. This attitude should only be for serious groups who play together on a regular basis, not in a LFG pickup group. It is an MMO, and not everybody will have the same game skills, specs, etc. Hardcore players need to stay out of LFG with this attitude.

Reverb

Jitterbug wrote: »

PBpsy wrote: »

AshySamurai wrote: »

AngryNord wrote: »

Rosveen wrote: »

What in the world possessed you to queue as a dps in full heavy with a shield?

My guess is it was the wording, "Play as you want". I might be mistaken, of course.

IMO play as you want doesn't mean that you can do all you want (like have high dps with s&b). It means if you want to have more survivability, you can use s&b regardless of your race or class. If you want to have more dps, you can use other weapon. And you can freely switch from one role to another.

One of my favorite aspects of the game is how well this game actually achieves what you just said. It is amazing how easy one can move from doing different roles. The game offer a lot of flexibility but "the play the way you want" is too often interpreted you can be as stubbornly rigid as you want

Yeah a lot of people read "play as you want" but see "win regardless of how you play"

But what I want is to win 1v1 against a dk 2 vet ranks above me, while having only healing and support skills slotted. It is clearly the game's fault that I'm unsuccessful at that. They need to fix the imbalance.

/sarcasm

Xsorus

/facepalm at this post..and some of the other players in it talking about "Why can't I be bad and force players to take me into dungeons/raids?"

Newsflash with anyone running silly builds that just don't work...That's fine if you're solo..The second you start wasting my time in groups...its no longer fine.

Elsonso

mazrimtaimxpreub18_ESO wrote: »

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

in dungeon and dragons online mmo, they allow anyone to purchase hirelings to help you through the dungeons. so anyone can play solo if they wish it.
i wish elderscrolls online did the same, would be awesome!
i prefer solo play with hirelings instead of group.

@dwemer_paleologist‌ - Please don't take offense as I certainly don't intend any - but why exactly do you play MMOs if you do not like playing with other people? There are a ton of great solo RPGs out there (especially TES games).

For my part in this, it is not that I don't want to play in groups. It is that I don't want to group with quite a few of the people who have commented in this thread. They don't want to group with me, either. I don't care how OP my character and play is, I simply don't want to play with them. Been there, done that, have the achievement. In another game. Since the box of chocolates applies here, I have decided to simply abstain and play solo until ZOS comes up with a way to filter out certain archetypical players.

I have a DK heavy two handed that none of you want to play with. It is a DK heavy two handed because that is what I wanted to play. It is built in a manner that allows me to keep PVE attackers off of me until I kill them, so it has some tank and some DPS. It does not do either role purely enough to meet with the approval of the critics. I don't use numbers but I do watch what is happening and make changes to eliminate areas where the character is under performing... based on the ability to keep them off of me until I kill them. My skill line choices and slotted skills are built around that and I am certain that no one cares what the specifics are.

I also have a NB dual wield medium that none of you want to play with. This guy is not a soldier and does not do well when ganged up on. He under performs on a lot of quest assignments where he is expected to wade in and tank.or CC in numbers. For example, the "protect me from three waves of attackers" quests. He is DPS but is not elite and he has survivability issues. He goes through 10x more healing potions than any other character I have and, as currently configured, is the poster boy for reducing the potion cool down. There are skill choices that I have not taken with this character that could improve his performance, but there are reason why those choices were not taken.

But, I have a Sorc destruction light that you people would have probably been thrilled to play with, provided I unslot the pet that tanks for me. This guy is outfitted with restoration as a strong second and can do both DPS and Heal, although Healing is still in need of development. This is the more elite build glass cannon that had been so overwhelmingly popular around here a couple months back. I cheated with this one, he wore a heavy belt to bring Armor up a little at lower levels. Today, he is exceptionally skilled at dying when alone but is OK if the foe can be dispatched quickly. The change they made to pet/summoned threat really hurt this one and the character is on the shelf while I decide if I want to keep him.

Because I use no numbers other than what is on the character screen, all of these characters are "tuned" based on how they perform in the PVE field and not on any theoretical calculations based on expectations built around numbers.

Will this get me to "max DPS"? Probably not. I might get there by accident, or by process of elimination, but once the character is able to win in PVE combat, I tend to stop tuning. I can see what the blockers are to success so I know where to put my attention, but once the blockers are eliminated, I stop looking to change things.

So, no, I don't want to group with a lot of you, and the reverse is equally true. What I want from ZOS is a way to filter out the elites so that I don't have to play with them and what the elites want is a way to filter out the people like me who are going to be wasting their time. DPS is not a measure because I may actually have DPS build that is acceptable to them. The mindset about how I play is far more important than the DPS or the acceptable nature of my build.

Aeratus

So, no, I don't want to group with a lot of you, and the reverse is equally true. What I want from ZOS is a way to filter out the elites so that I don't have to play with them and what the elites want is a way to filter out the people like me who are going to be wasting their time. DPS is not a measure because I may actually have DPS build that is acceptable to them. The mindset about how I play is far more important than the DPS or the acceptable nature of my build.

I think you're making this a bigger deal than what it really is.

What mindset? How do you know what my mindset is? When I do pug undaunted vet dungeon runs, I just finish the dungeon and that's it. Don't even chat that much.

BTW, for most vet dungeons I don't mind grouping with people with low dps, since my own dps is as good as two random pug'er dps's. (But you don't need to know that!) I do care about people who aren't able to stay out of the red, so for the harder dungeons, I don't do PUGs.

poodlemasterb16_ESO

lordrichter wrote: »

Because I use no numbers other than what is on the character screen, all of these characters are "tuned" based on how they perform in the PVE field and not on any theoretical calculations based on expectations built around numbers.

Will this get me to "max DPS"? Probably not. I might get there by accident, or by process of elimination, but once the character is able to win in PVE combat, I tend to stop tuning. I can see what the blockers are to success so I know where to put my attention, but once the blockers are eliminated, I stop looking to change things.

Those are all the numbers you need. I recommend softcapinfo, an addon that shows you where the softcap is, and how much you are into it.

It's a good idea to try to get the numbers important to your build up to the softcap. A sorc should try to have Max Magic and Magic Regen a bit into the orange for instance. The numbers determine everything so ignoring them is foolish.

I make each fighting char to be as overpowered as possible. It's a fighting game and winning is the point of battle.

Evandus

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

in dungeon and dragons online mmo, they allow anyone to purchase hirelings to help you through the dungeons. so anyone can play solo if they wish it.
i wish elderscrolls online did the same, would be awesome!
i prefer solo play with hirelings instead of group.

That is true on the surface. But hirelings are not allowed to be used in raid instances for example. I played that game for 6 years, and did many solo or two man raid runs for fun. Having a hireling available in raid instances would have completely undermined the need to group imo. So it was a good decision overall.

Reading a lot of the arguments put against people in this thread is weird. As a member of a moving and shaking kinda guild in DDO for years, I don't understand why it is that people in this game seem to feel that bringing characters into raid instances that are sub optimal is okay. It isn't...

I'm just getting around to trying out some of the end game stuff. For example I've completed AA once, and keep getting invited to do DSA, Sanctum, Hel Ra, COA and others. I wouldn't want to be the one that drags the group down, so I try to prepare the best I can by asking questions. And most importantly, listening to the answers.

My tank for example ran all through content up to AA with a light armor hybrid setup. And that setup worked well even in pledge dungeons. However, I learned after I was the cause of the group to fail in a run that I needed to change my setup. So I listened, and changed things up. And it worked. I still love my hybrid setup as well. So I keep them both. Wykkyd's allows you to swap on the fly. It really isn't that hard to do.

And that brings me to the conclusion that some people doing the most complaining about 'elitists' are simply too damn stuck in the mud to even consider changing anything for the benefit of the group. And that's a really poor attitude in a team setting to have.

Petros

Perhaps for the best dps that I can do as a Heavy S&B for SO is roughly 200dps.

Tanking both the Serpent and Manny on the Serpent fight, I'll take being hit less over me doing more dps any other day. So yes, for end game content, dps needs to be hitting those high numbers.

LoreScholar

The initial point of this post was to show that we can't play the way we want when doing trials, dungeon or even PvP.

Natjur

You can play the game anyway you want.
But the other 11 players in a trial run also want to play the game the way they want to, and most want to finish trials as fast as possible for the best reward and if your a DPS player but your 'style' of play is low dps, then don't expect them to change the way they want to play the game.

Lucas.interlichnrb18_ESO wrote: »

The initial point of this post was to show that we can't play the way we want when doing trials, dungeon or even PvP.

Its a fair point, anyone can play the way they want to if doing solo content, but any group content, your style is now effecting other players, and they have a right to pick who to do group content with.

They need to change the game 'mote' to 'You can play anyway you want, except when doing group stuff, cause then you have to work as a group and may need to adjust to fit'

Reverb

Lucas.interlichnrb18_ESO wrote: »

The initial point of this post was to show that we can't play the way we want when doing trials, dungeon or even PvP.

I disagree. You can play how you want, anywhere in game. But not with whomever you want. To insist that any group take you regardless of your setup would be to deny them the right to play how they want. There are groups that will take you no matter your build. It's not your place to deny those that won't

LoreScholar

Natjur wrote: »

You can play the game anyway you want.
But the other 11 players in a trial run also want to play it they game they way they want, and most want to finish trials as fast as possible for the best reward and if your a DPS player but your 'style' of play is low dps, then don't expect them to change they way they want to play the game.

I agree with you, they are playing the way they want. But what about the " Low DPS player"...is that playerplaying the way he wants?

LoreScholar

Reverb wrote: »

Lucas.interlichnrb18_ESO wrote: »

The initial point of this post was to show that we can't play the way we want when doing trials, dungeon or even PvP.

I disagree. You can play how you want, anywhere in game. But not with whomever you want. To insist that any group take you regardless of your setup would be to deny them the right to play how they want. There are groups that will take you no matter your build. It's not your place to deny those that won't

That's my point! not with everyone...
Yes, we can play the way we want. But in order to be effective you need to change your build (This a full Heavy Armor player typing) when playing with that kind of players.

Reverb

Lucas.interlichnrb18_ESO wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

Lucas.interlichnrb18_ESO wrote: »

The initial point of this post was to show that we can't play the way we want when doing trials, dungeon or even PvP.

I disagree. You can play how you want, anywhere in game. But not with whomever you want. To insist that any group take you regardless of your setup would be to deny them the right to play how they want. There are groups that will take you no matter your build. It's not your place to deny those that won't

That's my point! not with everyone...
Yes, we can play the way we want. But in order to be effective you need to change your build (This a full Heavy Armor player typing) when playing with t hekind of players.

Your point is a selfish one.

Then don't play with those players. Complaining about other players teamwork expectations is no better than their complaining about your build. If you don't want to conform with others' expectations, hang out with people with different expectations. In game and in real life. You don't like flat brims and fender flares, find different friends. Don't complain that flat brimmers don't enjoy the same things as you,just find people who do.

LoreScholar

Reverb wrote: »

Lucas.interlichnrb18_ESO wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

Lucas.interlichnrb18_ESO wrote: »

The initial point of this post was to show that we can't play the way we want when doing trials, dungeon or even PvP.

I disagree. You can play how you want, anywhere in game. But not with whomever you want. To insist that any group take you regardless of your setup would be to deny them the right to play how they want. There are groups that will take you no matter your build. It's not your place to deny those that won't

That's my point! not with everyone...
Yes, we can play the way we want. But in order to be effective you need to change your build (This a full Heavy Armor player typing) when playing with t hekind of players.

Your point is a selfish one.

Then don't play with those players. Complaining about other players teamwork expectations is no better than their complaining about your build. If you don't want to conform with others' expectations, hang out with people with different expectations. In game and in real life. You don't like flat brims and fender flares, find different friends. Don't complain that flat brimmers don't enjoy the same things as you,just find people who do.

I agree with you . "Complaining about other players teamwork expectations is no better than their complaining about your build."

Ysne58

Play the way you want is a sick joke. It's a promise the devs chose not to keep. It's an outright lie. Forced Solo. Forced Grouping. I do like the idea of being able to hire companions when we cannot find peole to group with. It's never going to happen because that is not what the devs want.

poodlemasterb16_ESO

Lucas.interlichnrb18_ESO wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

Lucas.interlichnrb18_ESO wrote: »

The initial point of this post was to show that we can't play the way we want when doing trials, dungeon or even PvP.

I disagree. You can play how you want, anywhere in game. But not with whomever you want. To insist that any group take you regardless of your setup would be to deny them the right to play how they want. There are groups that will take you no matter your build. It's not your place to deny those that won't

That's my point! not with everyone...
Yes, we can play the way we want. But in order to be effective you need to change your build (This a full Heavy Armor player typing) when playing with that kind of players.

Have you tried learning about this game? There is a whole very good set of possibilities you know.

Because I knew nothing about the game I have rolled a variety of characters that roughly represent the classes and fighting types. How else would I learn about them? My heavy S&B DK is my least played char. My sorcs the most, and my new NB is a stone joy. The first I have built from scratch since I have learned how the game works.

You can play how you want but death is what you get for any weak characters.

Drasn

Lucas.interlichnrb18_ESO wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

Lucas.interlichnrb18_ESO wrote: »

The initial point of this post was to show that we can't play the way we want when doing trials, dungeon or even PvP.

I disagree. You can play how you want, anywhere in game. But not with whomever you want. To insist that any group take you regardless of your setup would be to deny them the right to play how they want. There are groups that will take you no matter your build. It's not your place to deny those that won't

That's my point! not with everyone...
Yes, we can play the way we want. But in order to be effective you need to change your build (This a full Heavy Armor player typing) when playing with that kind of players.

Why wouldn't you want to be effective?

The are over 300 skill points in this game. If they are used wisely you can be ready for any situation.

Take my Templar for instance:

When tanking:
6 heavy, 1 light, 2xS/S- 5 piece footman, 5 piece histbark, 2 piece Valkin Skoria

When healing:
5 Light, 2 heavy, 2xResto - 5 Piece warlock, 4 piece Mara, 2 piece Bogdan

When Stamina DPS:
7 medium, 1xbow, 1x2H- 5 piece archers, 4 piece hundings, 2 piece twice fang

When magicka DPS:
7 light, 2xdestro- 4 piece aether, 4 piece twighlight, 3 piece soulshine

That's 4 different roles on 1 character. I just change gear and associated skills based on the role I'm filling. And with outfitter it takes only 1 keystroke to be geared and skilled for the role I'm to fill.

I don't get why people think that it's OK to hold 3-12 other people back just because they are unwilling to meet the needs of the group.

If you sign up as a tank you better understand how taunt works and be able to take a few hits.

If you sign up to heal your priorities better be heal > dps. And you better not run out of magicka every 3 casts.

If you sign up as DPS you are expected to put out acceptable levels of damage to help the group complete the task at hand. And remember dead DPS do no damage so stay out of the red.

If a tank is doing their job, heals are doing their job, and 1 DPS is doing 75%-80% of the overall damage... tell me how that 2nd DPS is doing anything other than being carried. Don't be that 2nd DPS.

Lord_Kreegan

We're human... well, you are. I'm something special... ;-) Ahem... okay, maybe not...

There will always be jerks in any game. There will always be elitists in any game. There will always be arrogant people in any game.

There will always be nice folks, fun folks, and people who just enjoy grouping with anyone, too.

There will always be smart players and there will also always be, let's just say, not-so-smart players.

Hey, we're human (well, you are).

The issue isn't the cornucopia of different personalities present in a game; the issue is that things like Trials are designed specifically for those players who want to compete... call it epeen, ego, pride, bragging rights, or whatever... and if a portion of a game is designed for competition, competitive players are going to look for an edge. Why? Damned if I know; it's not like being in the top 100 list is going to make them grow two inches taller and get bigger muscles, or make them smarter or sexier... but, hey; if that's their thing, then that's their thing.

So, if competitive players want to compete, they should be allowed to compete. ZOS is smart enough to know that catering to that personality type will keep them paying a subscription for as long as ZOS gives them an opportunity to stroke their epeens.

What the hell is an epeen, anyway?

Those players aren't going to penalize themselves and their chance to be in that top 100 list just because some other player wants to do things his own way. If a player doesn't want to be competitive, that's his choice, but it's not his choice to force others to be non-competitive... That shouldn't be too hard to understand.

In my case, I figure I'm already sexy enough that I don't need the competition... so I CAN play the way I want.

All kidding aside, what is missing, quite frankly, is a version of the trials that is "non-competitive"; that is, a "non-scored" version that doesn't compete for that top 100 list; or a version of some of the group dungeons that is targeted at those players who aren't looking for the phony titles of "hard core", "badass", "best-in-breed", or whatever... but, if you've paid attention from the beginning with this game -- keeping in mind the main guys came from DAoC -- the game design has always been targeted at separating "best-in-breed" from the rest of us dogs.

Kind of stupid, really, considering their crappy launch; great way to lose subscribers; but some folks just ain't too bright when it comes to targeting a product at a given market...

We could use a good group-finding tool, ALA what is used in SW-TOR, with delineation between regular everyday PUGs (easier dungeons) and premade groups (hard core dungeons).

That would go a long way to satisfying the desire to "play as you want".

Which still allows you to play stupid...

eliisra

Play the way you want to means the freedom to pick a dps build you feel comfortable with. It's not as if we're lacking choices here. Can go with a spell- or weapon power based builds. Choose between stacking magicka or stamina.

Than there's bow, DW, staffs or 2-Hander. Whatever you fancy.

But common sense...you can't dps in heavy using S&B. That's a tank spec. It's like trying to tank trials with a frost staff + clannfear pet or healing with a bow. There are limitations for each role, but also many options.

Sadly, there's still people being excluded while using actual dps builds, because they're playing a class or build others are biased against (that may or may not be under-performing slightly compared to current fotm stacking). Therein lies the real problem, not some made up scenario(like OP) about a confused dude trying to dps in tank gear

Mightylink

I don't care what anyone says, I've always been a battlemage in the previous 2 games and I'm not going to stop now.