First time playing an TANK character and very much need advice

b.makusub17_ESO

Just a little intro. ESO is my first MMO and have generally been playing since it came out. I'm a big elder scrolls fan which is why I got into it. Don't know anything about WoW etc. or how the roles are supposed to work DPS/Heal/Tank in other MMO's. I've played a DPS and Healer and have done pretty good. My heals is VR10, I've been through all the veteran dungeons so while I don't consider my self an expert by any means, I know the ropes.

For whatever reason, I've been intimidated to try a tank character. I've read many of the articles (If you know of a good one, feel free to post the link in addition to your comments) but still not sure I "get it" as many talk about what a tanking should be and how it's "not needed" in ESO. Not looking to debate that here, but rather looking for advice on how to be the best tank in ESO for what it is. I'm generally a solo player who enjoys grouping for the dungeons that require it and world bosses which is primary what I play, I am getting into PvP but not my main focus. Advice I'm primarily looking for is in the area of best build/tactics for PvE group veteran dungeons and trials.

Some of my questions are as follows.

My tank right now is a level 10. I've been putting my attribute points into Stamina and Health. But I find that with just a few clicks with my Two Handed skill line actives, I run out of Stamina very quickly. However, all the Dragon Heart class actives are all Magicka based.

1) Where should I be putting my attrib points to be best ESO tank for PvE vet group dungeons and trials? What should my point totals be by lvl 50?

1a) Why is stamina important with so many Magicka based actives?

2) Based on my V10 character, I've learned that I'll have enough points for all the passives by end game. However, which 1 or 2 DK active abilities should I focus on each of the following?

Aredent Flame
Draconic Power
Earthen Heart

Which are the best for tank and why?

3) What is the best Ultimate to train up first and second?

4) I want to use Two Handed, but is Sword and Shield the way to go and if so why?

5) In ESO, what is the Tank's job/role in the dungeons? Should a tank just focus on standing there blocking and taking a beating so the DPS can do their job? Or should a tank be able to dish out some damage?

I've seen some tanks look like they just stand there and block while some seem to throw out different attacks etc.

6) What question(s) didn't I ask?

Thanks in advance for participating in the discussion!

b.makusub17_ESO

7) I almost forgot - my main toon is an 8 trait crafter. What are the best armor sets for a tank? Crafted or dropped?

hutchinsonhatch

Here you go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uzScROmObg

b.makusub17_ESO

Hey thanks for the video! However I'm looking more for feedback as to player's experiences and their recommendations. What has worked for you?

Magdalina

Well, I'm not really a tank(vet 14 sorc here, tho I did try tanking for a while and I have a vet 1 tanky DK alt) but I'll try to answer what I can:)

Well, first of all, at just lvl 10, don't really bother with thinking too much about endgame. Try what you like, see how it goes. You can always respec all your skill and attribute points.

1)Attribute points are very argueable - partially because you can always gain the lacking attribute from enchantments, so if you put more points into magicka and enchants into health, you'll end up roughly the same as more points into health and enchants into magicka. Probably the most flexible idea is to put all/most in health, which is what many people do regardless of their role(and afterwards enchant their armor with whatever it is they need).
-
1a)Stamina is important for blocking and dodging. And the melee taunt, though you can always replace that one with magicka one(Inner Fire in Undaunted skill tree, you'll get it soon enough if you run some dungeons). However, if you run OOS when blocking against a hard hitting boss, you'll be deep in trouble. Even worse if you're using melee taunt - then you can't taunt boss again and he's gonna go after your fragile groupmates.
I wouldn't call stamina most important resource though. Best tanks I know are magicka based. They have just enough stam for (some) blocking and taunting, but they rely on magicka to selfheal, shield, CC and attack. But that's a matter of personal preference to a point, I think.

2)I'm not in the game right now, but you definitely want Green Dragonblood(selfheal+stam regen), Talons(CC) and banner...excuse me, Standard. These are the most useful tanky skills there. Also the spiky armor, I forget its name, for obvious reasons of extra defence.

3)See above, banner for life! It's DoT, incoming damage reduction and CC on synergy. It's amazing. I don't really see DKs using other ultimates much in PvE.

4)You need s&b as your primary weapon, because blocking. Also, until you unlock the undaunted taunt, your only taunt is gonna be the one in s&b line, so there's no avoiding that;) The main(and only) reason to stay with s&b once you get undaunted taunt is damage mitigation(and reduced block cost from passives), it's way better than what other weapons provide and it's invalueable in certain situations. However, your secondary can be a weapon of your choice. A lot of tanks go 2h, some prefer DW or bow. Actually, bow or not, you're going to need some ranged setup for certain bosses - not everything can be fought head-on. Two best tanks I know swap to staves. Yes, staves. Resto staff actually works great - heavy attack return a ton of magicka(there can never be too much magicka) and you can get an extra emergency heal there. Alternatively, destro for trash because there can never be too much Impulse(and since you can't really taunt 20 trash mobs, you'll just want to CC them and burn down as soon as possible). But that's up to you. Try dffeent things and see what you're most comfortable with and what works better for you;) Don't despair if something doesn't work at first.

5)Argueable. Dps have a "I do <x> dps" criteria, healers and tanks generally get judged by how well the group survives, so up to you. No one's gonna demand you do a ton of damage as a tank, but it's always welcome. And as a DK, you CAN do damage while tanking, I know a DK who can do 700-1000 dps while tanking certain bosses:) It's all about balancing the resources though. If you get carried away trying to dps and run out of resources for a taunt/miss a taunt, well...that's bad, a lot worse than if you just stood there doing nothing but blocking. If you get carried away dpsing, forget to block and die, that's no better. Your first and main job is to stay alive and keep boss on yourself. But once you get used to that, maybe you can start dishing out some damage, too, every little bit helps after all;)
It also really depends on the boss and the situation. Some bosses hit so hard you have to focus purely on dmg mitigation. Or if, for example, your healer goes down - dps might be able to res him, but you'll have to keep the boss busy on your own til then. Other bosses don't require that much blocking and stuff, so you have more freedom to do damage. There're also some dps races, where any dmg you do would be VERY welcome, no matter your role(vet Spindle boss #2, for example).

6)Haha, can't think of anything...besides, I already wrote a whole wall of text xD

7) There're different set combinations out there. A good dropped set is Footman, but it's vet 13-14 and only drop in DSA/vet DSA, which says something about the prices(30-40k for jewelry). It gives I think 8% extra damage mitigation for 5pc. Far as crafted sets go, a lot of people like Hist Bark for dodge chance when blocking. Spectre's Eye is also not bad(dodge chance after using a spell). You should look for yourself though;)

Hope this helps some.

ers101284b14_ESO

I play a tank so I will try to answer your questions as best I can.

1. Most tanks put all points into health then use glyphs of stamina on their armor to get stamina. I didn't use this method. I have 52 in health and 10 in stamina and use both health and magica glyphs.
1 a.) stamina is important for blocking, dodging, and some attacks.

2. I use Dragon Knight standard in the Ardent Flame line, Coagulating blood in the Draconic Power line, and Cinder Storm & Igneous Shield in the Earthen heart line So I have all passives in all areas maxed out.

3. Dragon Knight Standard. It really is the best one.

4. You can use 2 handed but Sword and Shield is better because it has Ransack for the taunt and a shield for damage mitigation. As a tank you have to take the damage so you want as much damage reduction as possible.

5. You are supposed to take the brunt of the damage but your job is also to keep hate off everyone else so they can do their job more effectively. Hard for the healer to heal you if he is taking damage. Unlike other MMO's though there are so many adds that you can't keep hate on all the enemies at once. Usually2-3 enemies is good. The most I have ever been able to keep hate on is 5 in a smaller space. There is no reason why you can't throw out attacks and help deal damage but that is not your main job. Keep healer alive and healer will keep you alive.

My Health is 3048/3162
Stamina 1695/2455
Weapon Critical 11.5%
Armor 2289/2020

I should have more in stamina so help myself out but you can also eat food for that. Always have food ready to go.

My Skills
Ransack- decreases enemies armor/ Buffs my armor,and I use it as my taunt when I need to pull aggro off another member

Crippling Slash-Snares, Reduces enemies damage done,and generates ultimate

Cinder Storm-Snares, Deals Damage and gives the the enemies a chance at missing you altogether

Igneous Shield-Creates a shield around allies while dealing damage and increases your own shield by 100% Also buffs your healing abilities

Coagulating Blood-Heals you for 33% of missing damage, increases your health recovery, and boost your armor and spell resistance.

Dragon Knight Standard-Deals damage, Reduces your damage taken, boosts damage you do and allows the shackle synergy to immobilize enemies.

I also have Crushing glyph on my sword that reduces the enemies armor. I don't know if it stacks with Ransack or not.

So if I'm just starting out I just use regular attack to pull the mob, I then pop igneous shield for the buff, once I get aggro on 3-4 mobs I pop cinder storm, I then use ransack randomly to keep hate, and crippling slash on the main enemy like the boss. I use Coagulating Blood in a pinch or it looks like the healer needs help. I use DragonKnight Standard when I can get the most amount of enemies in the area.

Hope this helps and if you have any more questions just ask.

AshySamurai

1. I put ~50 points in HP, the rest in Stamina
1a. Stamina is important because you need to taunt and block all the way. Sometimes you need to roll from AoE (you're a tank, so you near the boss all the time).
2. I don't use Ardent Flame passives. Sometimes I use Fiery Grip (it very usefull in DSA). I think Dragon Blood is must have (boost your stamina regen). Also, I use Obsidian Shaield if I see that someone going to die (I give a few more seconds for healer to heal).
3. Standart is pretty good ult. Magma Armor can give you a lot of survivability. Pack Leader morph (allies gain ultimate faster) is not bad IMO. But in party mostly Standart.
4. S&B because you need:
1)to reduce block cost;
2)increse block mitigation;
3)taunt skill.
But 2H isn't bad and you can use it as a finisher (You're DK, right? So, you don't have class finishers).
5. It depends on situation. But mostly tank need to agro a few most dangerous mobs. Other trash should be killed fast by DD. But if you can help without loosing agro - why not to do it?
6. You didn't ask about enchants. I have all stamina. Boon - you desigion. The tower isn't bad disigion. Or the lady. Also, it depends on type of armor you use. About armor - I use all heavy. But it's possible to tank even in full light.
7. Hist Bark and Footman isn't bad sets for tank (footman is pretty expensive, but once it dropped 3 times in one DSA run). But sets - it's only your desigion. If you're not min/max-er, then you can tank in trash items.

Audigy

My tank has a mix of HP and Stamina, nothing in Magicka.

At ESO you often only tank the big guys, while the trash should be crowd controlled by the DPS + be taken down asap.

As a tank you obviously get hit but should always dodge the big attacks from the bosses, you can see those if they "charge their abilities" or shout something (red text).

Small attacks should be blocked with your shield.


As for 2 hand, I have no experience with this so I can not judge if this is a viable spec for a tank at ESO. Tank is relative anyways, the taunt abilities that we have are not bullet proof and bind everything to you like at WOW.

Something important however, try to not get hit in the back and always face bosses away from your group as they can have nasty cleave attacks or AOE coming out of their "front".

I tend to tank bosses with my back to a wall (some do have knockbacks) and dodge to the left and right if necessary.


The rest has been well explained already. Good Luck.

hutchinsonhatch

b.makusub17_ESO wrote: »

Hey thanks for the video! However I'm looking more for feedback as to player's experiences and their recommendations. What has worked for you?

For me, exactly this approach to any class is what is working. Cover the different scenarios (single-target DPS, AOE-DPS, single-target-tanking and multiple-target-tanking by minimizing their damage-output and preventing them to hit your team).
As he states in the video, the very basic conception of this build-system is what makes it shine and I am constantly asking myself, where to put the precious next skill-point.

I deviated from the path he points out by investing into the passives instead of the hireling, because at around level 20, the materials aren't exactly rare to come by while playing.

I'm using s&b and a 2-hander, I dropped the 2 pieces of non-heavy armour I wore until level 15 or so, as soon as both paths hit 10.

Right now, I'm trying to find armour-pieces that provide the traits I need to craft the set pieces I want. The Death's Wind-set is what I am currently aiming for. I don't know yet, what I am going to wear later on in the game, though.

For it's all about feeling comfortable and having fun, I'm having both right now. I thought that build to be less quick at killing stuff, but it's actually quite powerful, esp. with all the cc you have at your disposal.

When I am soloing, I step back when stamina becomes an issue to regenerate, because I am not very fond of the quickslot-wheel-thingy, so that the health potion is hotkeyed. When a healer is around, I swap that to stamina potions, until my stamina-recovery will be high enough.

I am still in the learning process, but quite confident.

hutchinsonhatch

Let me add one more thing for the interested: Below level 15, we unfortunately cannot swap weapons and skill-bars with a single click. We absolutely need to alternate the different setups right from the start (single-target, AOE), so it is necessary to change setups manually in order to level them appropriately.
We can kill anything below level 15 with one of the two setups, but I don't consider it to be a smooth experience to start with the second setup at level 15.

It should be self-explanatory, but who knows... so I added this.

AlexDougherty

If you are a level 10 DK, go for draconic power line and get Spiked Armour, it will keep you alive until you can get the Dragonblood skill.

Also look at the passives in 1hand and shield, these will help when you block.
Immovable in Heavy Armour skill line will help too, as will Heavy armour passives.

/Set+Bonus+Crafting+Locations
Above link shows sets and where you can make them, I might suggest Hist Bark/Whitestrake's Retribution for 4 Trait set, and Alessia's Bulwark is quite good too.

hutchinsonhatch

AlexDougherty wrote: »

If you are a level 10 DK, go for draconic power line and get Spiked Armour, it will keep you alive until you can get the Dragonblood skill.

Also look at the passives in 1hand and shield, these will help when you block.
Immovable in Heavy Armour skill line will help too, as will Heavy armour passives.

/Set+Bonus+Crafting+Locations
Above link shows sets and where you can make them, I might suggest Hist Bark/Whitestrake's Retribution for 4 Trait set, and Alessia's Bulwark is quite good too.

The Histbark Dodge-bonus is permanent? Oh, holy cow... thanks for the heads-up.

Draxys

1) all health. As a tank, health is more important than stamina (as long as you have the right gear and passive skills), and you can have plenty of each with all health attributes plus set bonuses/enchants.

1a) Obviously stamina is needed for lots of blocking, and the occasional dodge roll and break free. But really, you don't need as much stamina as you think, as long as you have the right gear and passives. As a v14, with all 1H/S passives, and the Hist Bark and Footman sets, the only time I ever have low stamina is when I'm tanking 5+ things in DsA.
That being said, I don't worry about magicka since I can use Spell Symmetry to trade my health for magicka when it's needed, and I play with good healers who can keep me up when I do that. When tanking a boss I don't ever use Spell Sym, but I do on trash pulls quite a lot so I can help AoE them down. For bosses, I use the ranged magicka taunt Inner Beast from the Undaunted line so I don't have to be close to taunt.

2) I wouldn't be too concerned with focusing on any skill line, they should all be maxed by the time you get to high vet ranks, but there are a couple skills that stand out that every tank should have on their bars- Unstable Flame and Engulfing Flames so you can add in some extra DPS, Green Dragon Blood for a self heal just in case, Igneous Weapons to buff everyone's weapon damage, and Extended Chains to help pull in adds.

3) Standard of Might for sure, it's one of the best PvE ultimates. Second would be Magma Shell.

4) Sword and Shield as absolutely the way to go for main tanking bar, simply because the damage mitigation is way higher than not having a shield in your hand. Maybe you could work two handed into your second bar for extra skills like Chains/Igneous/etc, and throw in the 2H AoE ability for trash mobs. Might not be a bad setup, I'd try it if my 2H were higher than lvl 13 :P

5) Tanks focus changes from boss to boss, really. For many of them, you kind of just turn the boss a certain way and stay out of the red cones/circles and shift position when needed, but some bosses force you out of that mold. One in particular makes you circle room as you will have a fire debuff on you that puts permanent flames on the ground.
Adding DPS is something that every tank should be doing, in my opinion. My main bar is Green Dragon Blood, Defensive Posture, Inner Beast, Engulfing Flames, Unstable Flame, Standard of Might. Two DPS abilities gets me anywhere from 150-300 dps. Doesn't sound like much, but when a boss has 200-300k health, it can make a difference.

6) None I can think of

ers101284b14_ESO

hutchinsonhatch wrote: »

AlexDougherty wrote: »

If you are a level 10 DK, go for draconic power line and get Spiked Armour, it will keep you alive until you can get the Dragonblood skill.

Also look at the passives in 1hand and shield, these will help when you block.
Immovable in Heavy Armour skill line will help too, as will Heavy armour passives.

/Set+Bonus+Crafting+Locations
Above link shows sets and where you can make them, I might suggest Hist Bark/Whitestrake's Retribution for 4 Trait set, and Alessia's Bulwark is quite good too.

The Histbark Dodge-bonus is permanent? Oh, holy cow... thanks for the heads-up.

All crafted sets like that the bonus is permanent. A lot of tanks use Hist but it can cause you to dodge heals also. So just be aware of that until they fix it.

hutchinsonhatch

ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »

All crafted sets like that the bonus is permanent. A lot of tanks use Hist but it can cause you to dodge heals also. So just be aware of that until they fix it.

I am far from being able to craft the full 5 pieces yet, so I will be heading for the Death's Wind for the time being, crafted by none other than my Altmer character, who is desperately trying to gether some spidersilk the past 2 days.

Hybris6

Sorry did not have the time to read the whole post but the basics are:

Point the pointed end towards the enemy...

AlexDougherty

Hybris6 wrote: »

Sorry did not have the time to read the whole post but the basics are:

Point the pointed end towards the enemy...

That's the basics behind dps, NOT TANKING.

Basics of tanking are Damage Mitigation, taunts (but not for this MMO), and keeping the mobs away from the healer.

leeux

I'd also add a recommendation for watching the streamer DefaTank, he's a very good tank and streams almost every day.

If you have a twitch account you can ask him in chat any question you want and will respond you as best he can while he plays.

EDIT: broken URL

Hybris6

AlexDougherty wrote: »

Hybris6 wrote: »

Sorry did not have the time to read the whole post but the basics are:

Point the pointed end towards the enemy...

That's the basics behind dps, NOT TANKING.

Basics of tanking are Damage Mitigation, taunts (but not for this MMO), and keeping the mobs away from the healer.

Well Sir you are right..but you also need some pointy thingie to poke the MOB with to keep him want to hit you.. otherwise you would go with 2 shields? If you are a good tank with lots of HP you dont need the healer anyway.. you can pop pots..the healer is more for the wozzy mages and if you have a pointy thing to poke with you dont need the mages either..

So tank LFG wanna join for trials?