Whats a solo Player to do?(Craglorn)

Muizer

My main problem with forced group content is that unlike solo questing and PvP, even in public dungeons, you play knowing you cannot take a break whenever you want. Not without people getting PO at you anyway. I don't like that at all. I don't mind ZoS making content like this, but I do hope it's not the only way to keep up in terms of leveling for PvP, for instance.

MikeBob

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

(...) MMO's are meant to be played with other people. That's just how it is. (...)

Wrong. By definition, MMO's allow massive numbers of people to play the same online game simultaneously. Period. That definition does not speak to how (or if) those people will interact while engaged in said online gameplay.

I don't spend my gaming dollar in order to be your forced or unwilling online playmate. I never have (in 15 years of online gaming), and I never will.

Guppet

MikeBob wrote: »

Mcskinner wrote: »

I spend about 90% of my playtime either solo or by chance with other players who happen to be doing the exact same thing I am doing at the exact same time.

(...)

Play a different game?

The above portion of your post describes precisely how I've progressed through the game thus far (for the most part) - and the last part indicates how I intend to deal with the problem of 'what to do' when my toon is ready for Craglorn. (My first character just began Cadwell's Gold @ VR6.)

I spend lots of time exploring, gathering/harvesting mats, and farming drops for gold to upgrade inventory and bank space, etc - and in the last three zones of Cad's Silver, I've rarely seen more than 3 or 4 others in several hours of gameplay. These zones really seemed to me like ghost towns compared to the pre-veteran content I played through.

I've skipped all the group dungeons along the way (although I've died a lot in most of them - they're nothing more than zerg-fests, really), and I only managed to get anything accomplished in those public dungeons (more 'zerg' content) where I was able to progress with others who ran them while I happened to be there (and who also agreed to allow me to tag along).

Also, if I had a nickel for all the VR10-14 toons I've seen trying to solo bosses and anchors in the VR1-5 zones I've played through (most of whom gladly accepted my help), I'm sure I'd have enough for a lunchtime sit-down at the local Cheap Chinese Buffet.

I won't pvp and what I've learned about the nature of grouping in Craglorn (in threads like this one) is more than a little discouraging.

I'll likely play around with an alt or two, for a little while, once I get this first toon to the end of Cad's Gold - but after that gets boring I intend to exercise the "Play a different game" option.

Be sure they want your help, if they are soloing dolmans and bosses though. I am soloing VR 8 dolmans at VR 6, bosses too, it's a fun challenge. It's very possible provided you concentrate. Bosses are incredibly easy if they can be disoriented, which most can.

Ghettobird52

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

MikeBob

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

Who said anything about a console? I play all my games on my trusty PC (and I always have).

And who said anything about acquiring 'the highest ranked gear'? I craft all my own gear and, aside from beginner/newbie stuff, it's the only gear my toons will ever equip.

As for soloing in a 'massively multiplayer' game, let me break it down for you: "massively multiplayer" only means that scads of individuals (multiple players) can be logged into /engaged with the same (massive) virtual environment at the same time. It does NOT mean that they all have to be doing the same thing while logged in, nor does it mean that they all must do whatever they're doing together, or at the same time (Serious answer).

R1ckyDaMan

I have said it before and will say it again...

Forced group content = Instanced
Normal content = Open world

Rune_Relic

Problem 1 - lfg tool doesnt work.
Problem 2 - few want to to do the content if it did.
Problem 3 - no group = no access
Problem 4 - I was in glenumbra lastnight cadwell silver. Over 4 hours I briefly came across 3 people in total. You'll be lucky to find 2 man groups let alone 4..... and 12 man groups .....lol
Problem 5 - Many players come from TES solo and arent comfortable joining up with others.
Problem 6 - Lots of pugs are abusive and unfriendly with absolutely no patience with inexperienced players. Driving many away from groups.
Problem 7 - lots of solo players need/want group practice but need to learn at their own pace.
Problem 8 - quests are normally done with people who have no interest in the quest and no patience to wait for you forcing you to rush content.

The solution to all this..... NPC MERCENARIES.
All problems solved.

MikeBob

Muizer wrote: »

My main problem with forced group content is that unlike solo questing and PvP, even in public dungeons, you play knowing you cannot take a break whenever you want. (...)

This is a *huge* reason for my solo play style preference (although it's not the only reason). Other reasons include (but are not limited to) the so-called 'requirement' imposed by guild/group leaders for vent or teamspeak use, the accelerated pace (breaks notwithstanding) of most grouped play, and having to put up with the unacceptable language and/or behavior of complete strangers who are grouped together for no other reason than they must be grouped, in order to achieve whatever is necessary to satisfy some quest requirement or other.

Leeric

I get why people complain about crag being group content. But honestly most end game stuff should be group. You can easily find people looking for groups in crags zone chat. Same with guilds who advertise. You can also toss up LF PvE guild. You can farm mats and kill wasps but that's It for solo content in crag really.

MikeBob

Rune_Relic wrote: »

Problem 1 - lfg tool doesnt work.
Problem 2 - few want to to do the content if it did.
Problem 3 - no group = no access
Problem 4 - I was in glenumbra lastnight cadwell silver. Over 4 hours I briefly came across 3 people in total. You'll be lucky to find 2 man groups let alone 4..... and 12 man groups .....lol
Problem 5 - Many players come from TES solo and arent comfortable joining up with others.
Problem 6 - Lots of pugs are abusive and unfriendly with absolutely no patience with inexperienced players. Driving many away from groups.
Problem 7 - lots of solo players need/want group practice but need to learn at their own pace.
Problem 8 - quests are normally done with people who have no interest in the quest and no patience to wait for you forcing you to rush content.

The solution to all this..... NPC MERCENARIES.
All problems solved.

In the MMO's I've played (and I can think of two right off the bat) where NPC mercs were an option, they worked out very well, in my experience.

I've really enjoyed those few quests I've run into in ESO, where I was given the option of bringing along my choice an NPC sidekick (meleer or caster, etc.)

All ESO quest content should not be structured this way, in my view, but it's a fun refreshing change, when it comes along.

theyancey

We solo PvE types are not wanted here.

Tabbycat

I remain hopeful that solo players will be able to just go to the new solo Adventure Zone that is coming out and completely bypass Craglorn. I'm a solo player myself, and while I do plan on fiddling around a bit in Craglorn, I don't really want to attempt to level up there.

I can never remember the name of that zone.

Guppet

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

What a silly comment! Tell me another mainstream MMO launched in the past decade that does not let you reach level cap completely solo? Go on!

It's not Elder scrolls expectations to reach max level solo, it's anyone that played an MMO in the past 10 years.

MikeBob

theyancey wrote: »

We solo PvE types are not wanted here.

It's a pretty sad state of affairs in a game like this one but, the more I level my toon in ESO, the less evidence I see to contradict this statement.

It's a shame, too, because there's so much to love about this game - and I'm not only referring to the carryover of lore and history from the rest of the TES franchise - there are LOADS of 'nice touches' in ESO to enjoy (and, indeed, sometimes even to marvel at) that most (if not all) of the MMO's I've played are utterly devoid of.

It sucks that, unless one is willing to submit to the zerg-group way of doing things (not to mention pvp, which I personally abhor), ESO becomes a mere stepping stone to Whatever's Next in the realm of MMO gaming.

LonePirate

Tabbycat wrote: »

I remain hopeful that solo players will be able to just go to the new solo Adventure Zone that is coming out and completely bypass Craglorn. I'm a solo player myself, and while I do plan on fiddling around a bit in Craglorn, I don't really want to attempt to level up there.

I can never remember the name of that zone.

That zone is named Wrothgar (or possibly Hrothgar like the recent reward vanity pet) and it won't here until at least March at the earliest, possibly even later. Update 5, Update 6 (PVP Imperial City?) and Update 7 (Murkmire?) are all queued up for before Wrothgar/Hrothgar.

Ghettobird52

Guppet wrote: »

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

What a silly comment! Tell me another mainstream MMO launched in the past decade that does not let you reach level cap completely solo? Go on!

It's not Elder scrolls expectations to reach max level solo, it's anyone that played an MMO in the past 10 years.

WoW

Like I said 1-50 was enough solo action zenimax should have stopped it at 50 and all vet ranks be group action. By highest rank gear and level I ment Ilvl . I don't know any mmo in the past decade that allows you to get the best gear soloing. Point blank period.

TES players just don't want to admit it but this is a mmo, not a single player game, your going to have to group. Deal with it.

Nox_Aeterna

Nothing OP , that is the answer , and more and more of us solo players are getting to this point and more and more subs are leaving this game , that simple.

Currently i can honestly say i have close to nothing other than hunt some achivs and research on my char , i barely even log in this game anymore only reason im still subbed is because of the TES title and lore i know i will lose the moment i unsub.

I dont resub to MMOs , this wont change because of this game that is for sure lols , well , soon will be time to leave it.

hammer_fella

LonePirate wrote: »

That zone is named Wrothgar (or possibly Hrothgar like the recent reward vanity pet) and it won't here until at least March at the earliest, possibly even later. Update 5, Update 6 (PVP Imperial City?) and Update 7 (Murkmire?) are all queued up for before Wrothgar/Hrothgar.

It's Wrothgar, not Hrothgar.

High Hrothgar (from whence the wraith derives its name) is in central Skyrim, on the Throat of the World. Wrothgar is a mountainous region on the Skyrim/High Rock border, home to the oft-conquered home of the Orcs, Orsinium.

Ghettobird52

MikeBob wrote: »

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

Who said anything about a console? I play all my games on my trusty PC (and I always have).

And who said anything about acquiring 'the highest ranked gear'? I craft all my own gear and, aside from beginner/newbie stuff, it's the only gear my toons will ever equip.

As for soloing in a 'massively multiplayer' game, let me break it down for you: "massively multiplayer" only means that scads of individuals (multiple players) can be logged into /engaged with the same (massive) virtual environment at the same time. It does NOT mean that they all have to be doing the same thing while logged in, nor does it mean that they all must do whatever they're doing together, or at the same time (Serious answer).

Nobody said anything about having to do ALL things together or EVERY SECOND is grouped, but you NEED to realize in a mmo there is going to be MANDATORY grouped events. If there was no need to group why even make it online any ways?

I don't know any mmo that is 100% completely single player, that would NOT be an mmo. Deal with it

Rosveen

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

What a silly comment! Tell me another mainstream MMO launched in the past decade that does not let you reach level cap completely solo? Go on!

It's not Elder scrolls expectations to reach max level solo, it's anyone that played an MMO in the past 10 years.

Like I said 1-50 was enough solo action zenimax should have stopped it at 50 and all vet ranks be group action.

Do you want to kill this game? Serious question.

Guppet

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

What a silly comment! Tell me another mainstream MMO launched in the past decade that does not let you reach level cap completely solo? Go on!

It's not Elder scrolls expectations to reach max level solo, it's anyone that played an MMO in the past 10 years.

WoW

Like I said 1-50 was enough solo action zenimax should have stopped it at 50 and all vet ranks be group action. By highest rank gear and level I ment Ilvl . I don't know any mmo in the past decade that allows you to get the best gear soloing. Point blank period.

TES players just don't want to admit it but this is a mmo, not a single player game, your going to have to group. Deal with it.

Oh I see your trolling. I played wow from vanilla, got to 60 totally solo, just fine. Give me a real example or get back under your bridge.

MornaBaine

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

Ideally we should pretty much be able to do both all the way through, including dungeons. I like playing with my guildies, people I know. I am not so keen to play with strangers and my guildies aren't always up for doing the same thing I am. I should be able to play this game when I can't sleep at 3:00AM and not have to worry about whether or not I'll be able to find people to play with me. That's my serious answer.

MikeBob

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

What a silly comment! Tell me another mainstream MMO launched in the past decade that does not let you reach level cap completely solo? Go on!

It's not Elder scrolls expectations to reach max level solo, it's anyone that played an MMO in the past 10 years.

WoW

Like I said 1-50 was enough solo action zenimax should have stopped it at 50 and all vet ranks be group action. By highest rank gear and level I ment Ilvl . I don't know any mmo in the past decade that allows you to get the best gear soloing. Point blank period.

TES players just don't want to admit it but this is a mmo, not a single player game, your going to have to group. Deal with it.

(Again I ask) Who said anything about acquiring "the best gear" via solo play?

How about simply being able to play through the content provided?

Labeling me (or anyone) a 'TES' or 'console' player lends no credibility whatsoever to your argument, @Ghettobird52, and you really should get a handle on the difference between 'single player' games and solo play in an MMO - because it's a big one.

Your 'Deal With It' attitude is precisely the reason I go scurrying in the opposite direction when I see players like you ingame, and I submit to you that I have as much right to my style of play as you do to yours.

In fact, if the 95% (or so) of the game content that I've been able to do on my own has any bearing on the matter (and I'm certain that it does), I'd say ESO is more my kind of game than it is yours.

I'm sorry, but I didn't get the 'My Way or the Highway' memo.

EDIT: P/S

@‌Ghettobird52

And oh yeah - although I've played at least a half dozen MMO's since Bill Clinton was in the White House, World of Warcraft was never one of them - just so ya know.

Soloeus

Rune_Relic wrote: »

Problem 1 - lfg tool doesnt work.
Problem 2 - few want to to do the content if it did.
Problem 3 - no group = no access
Problem 4 - I was in glenumbra lastnight cadwell silver. Over 4 hours I briefly came across 3 people in total. You'll be lucky to find 2 man groups let alone 4..... and 12 man groups .....lol
Problem 5 - Many players come from TES solo and arent comfortable joining up with others.
Problem 6 - Lots of pugs are abusive and unfriendly with absolutely no patience with inexperienced players. Driving many away from groups.
Problem 7 - lots of solo players need/want group practice but need to learn at their own pace.
Problem 8 - quests are normally done with people who have no interest in the quest and no patience to wait for you forcing you to rush content.

The solution to all this..... NPC MERCENARIES.
All problems solved.

I agree with your problems but not sure about mercs. I remember the npc "help" from the quests and they were worse than newbs.

R1ckyDaMan

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

MikeBob wrote: »

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

Who said anything about a console? I play all my games on my trusty PC (and I always have).

And who said anything about acquiring 'the highest ranked gear'? I craft all my own gear and, aside from beginner/newbie stuff, it's the only gear my toons will ever equip.

As for soloing in a 'massively multiplayer' game, let me break it down for you: "massively multiplayer" only means that scads of individuals (multiple players) can be logged into /engaged with the same (massive) virtual environment at the same time. It does NOT mean that they all have to be doing the same thing while logged in, nor does it mean that they all must do whatever they're doing together, or at the same time (Serious answer).

Nobody said anything about having to do ALL things together or EVERY SECOND is grouped, but you NEED to realize in a mmo there is going to be MANDATORY grouped events. If there was no need to group why even make it online any ways?

I don't know any mmo that is 100% completely single player, that would NOT be an mmo. Deal with it

But forced group content is normally behind an instance and not open world.
Open world should be just that, open.

KenjiJU

Moudeed wrote: »

Really disappointing in how the Devs are focusing on Guilds / group play and not the solo players. They must feel the Guilds and those that need an mmo to have friends are the true test of TESO financial success but this will prove to be their game failing.
I will continue to play and see but if this is the path of ESO I will be looking or going back to other mmos.

I'm mostly a solo player, but I don't feel this way. They didn't have an end game at release, so that was their focus to start. You really can't keep a hardcore base on board with nothing to do. VR ranks were scaled down in favor of solo players, and they've announced solo content (pretty early for a game like this IMO) with Wrothgar.

Yea, Craglorn in its current form is awful, but it sounds like they're working on it. Hopefully they'll learn from it and put that experience toward Murkmire.

Ghettobird52

Guppet wrote: »

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

What a silly comment! Tell me another mainstream MMO launched in the past decade that does not let you reach level cap completely solo? Go on!

It's not Elder scrolls expectations to reach max level solo, it's anyone that played an MMO in the past 10 years.

WoW

Like I said 1-50 was enough solo action zenimax should have stopped it at 50 and all vet ranks be group action. By highest rank gear and level I ment Ilvl . I don't know any mmo in the past decade that allows you to get the best gear soloing. Point blank period.

TES players just don't want to admit it but this is a mmo, not a single player game, your going to have to group. Deal with it.

Oh I see your trolling. I played wow from vanilla, got to 60 totally solo, just fine. Give me a real example or get back under your bridge.

Exactly dude like I said zenimax should have started group process at vet ranks when it's considered 'end game top gear' if you played vanilla wow were you able to get even 1 PIECE of tier one from soloing? NOPE! Your the troll trying to act like you don't see what I'm pointing at.

R1ckyDaMan

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

What a silly comment! Tell me another mainstream MMO launched in the past decade that does not let you reach level cap completely solo? Go on!

It's not Elder scrolls expectations to reach max level solo, it's anyone that played an MMO in the past 10 years.

WoW

Like I said 1-50 was enough solo action zenimax should have stopped it at 50 and all vet ranks be group action. By highest rank gear and level I ment Ilvl . I don't know any mmo in the past decade that allows you to get the best gear soloing. Point blank period.

TES players just don't want to admit it but this is a mmo, not a single player game, your going to have to group. Deal with it.

Oh I see your trolling. I played wow from vanilla, got to 60 totally solo, just fine. Give me a real example or get back under your bridge.

Exactly dude like I said zenimax should have started group process at vet ranks when it's considered 'end game top gear' if you played vanilla wow were you able to get even 1 PIECE of tier one from soloing? NOPE! Your the troll trying to act like you don't see what I'm pointing at.

WOW is a steaming pile I do not give 1 **** about.

Ghettobird52

MikeBob wrote: »

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Ghettobird52 wrote: »

All these tes/console players not understanding how a mmo works. I don't understand players expecting a mmo allow you to get the highest ranked gear/level by soloing. You need to expect group action in a mmo it's inevitable. Soloing 1-50 is enough that zenimax should have given. Vet ranks should have been all group content not another quest race, that way console gamers would of got the idea of how mmos work. What's the point of a 'massively multiplayer' if you solo!?!!!!!!! (Serious question)

What a silly comment! Tell me another mainstream MMO launched in the past decade that does not let you reach level cap completely solo? Go on!

It's not Elder scrolls expectations to reach max level solo, it's anyone that played an MMO in the past 10 years.

WoW

Like I said 1-50 was enough solo action zenimax should have stopped it at 50 and all vet ranks be group action. By highest rank gear and level I ment Ilvl . I don't know any mmo in the past decade that allows you to get the best gear soloing. Point blank period.

TES players just don't want to admit it but this is a mmo, not a single player game, your going to have to group. Deal with it.

(Again I ask) Who said anything about acquiring "the best gear" via solo play?

How about simply being able to play through the content provided?

Labeling me (or anyone) a 'TES' or 'console' player lends no credibility whatsoever to your argument, @Ghettobird52, and you really should get a handle on the difference between 'single player' games and solo play in an MMO - because it's a big one.

Your 'Deal With It' attitude is precisely the reason I go scurrying in the opposite direction when I see players like you ingame, and I submit to you that I have as much right to my style of play as you do to yours.

In fact, if the 95% (or so) of the game content that I've been able to do on my own has any bearing on the matter (and I'm certain that it does), I'd say ESO is more my kind of game than it is yours.

I'm sorry, but I didn't get the 'My Way or the Highway' memo.

EDIT: P/S

@‌Ghettobird52

And oh yeah - although I've played at least a half dozen MMO's since Bill Clinton was in the White House, World of Warcraft was never one of them - just so ya know.

MMO does not allow a single player to 'beat the game' on his complete sole own. Then we should agree that this game is NOT an mmo, if that's the case I will agree. But if we try to act like it's an mmo then you need to realize your going to have to group. Realize it, sorry you don't like my thoughts as there not as 'idealistic' as you. I'm a realist and that's the way It is sorry.

Ghettobird52

@MikeBob‌ it's pretty obvious you haven't played wow.