Why is everything 'too powerful for this effect'?

Tavore1138

I am getting a little sick of everything I face in VR triggering this message when I try to engage it.

Snare.... Target is too powerful for this effect
Snare with Ultimate... Target is too powerful for this effect
Stun.... Target is too powerful for this effect
Stun with Ultimate... Target is too powerful for this effect
Sparks... Target is too powerful for this effect
And on and on and on.... Target is too powerful for this effect

What is the purpose of making us earn skills to learn and level if when the chips are down they are useless and we are left relying on light hits, dodging, reflexes and luck?

I might as well be running around naked with a letter opener instead of wasting time creating a character build because every Target is too powerful for this effect....

Is this just a melee/NB problem based on the hatred the devs feel for us or do Templars, Sorcs & DKs get the same grief?

irishdexy

Some Bosses and mini bosses have this immunity to snares. I get it on my Sorc and on my DK as well as my NB.

Artemiisia

most Bosses not some, are immune to all cc, and high lvl monster like gargoyles.

its here were you really need to look at what you are using and adjust to what you are killing, you wont be able to run through the life of eso, using the same skills from lvl 1 to vr12

kaosodin

Hehe yea, bugs me.

KleanZlate

If the boss doesn't have a ridiculous amount of HP it can be rewarding to slay someone that's immune to almost everything you throw at him. It also forces you to think a bit outside of the box and be creative. I just recently had to fight a frost atronact that had about 3500 hp. That's doable even though my dark cloak didn't even hide me from him.

Limitless

Zenimax wants you to group up with your guildmates, friends, or random people in VR zones to get stuff done.
They're all flowing with the population to do so, right?

Right?

AlexDougherty

Flying creatures are also immune to snare, even if they just levitate (ie flame attronachs)

Yes, a lot of the skills don't affect pve monsters properly, it's not a case of them being immune to some, and you choosing wisely, they are just immune to nearly all.

I think some of them are more for pvp, but wouldn't be surprised if they don't work there either.

Brasseurfb16_ESO

The only thing killing me in those immunities is the fact you can poison Daedric creatures and burn Flame Atronauchs but yet, halve of the freaking creatures in the game are immune to bleeds wich are a source of extra dps in some of your weapon skill lines.

It just makes no sense at all... Oh and undead and plant like creatures get extra damage and a stun from fire dmg but I haven't seen anything similar with the other elements available to players... Why is that so?

Sakiri

Yeah dwand 2h rely on bleed as opposed to upfront damage yet half the mobs it seems are immune to bleed. It bs.

And cc is what lets you solo crap. I hate it in VR because armor doesnt mean anything, spell resist doesnt mean anything, mobs immune to cc wreck you as if youre naked anyway so builds designed around low dps/high survival get wrecked and have to turn to dress/stick.

Tavore1138

I refuse to go stick (even though rumour is i would not go back).

And for context purposes I am in my VR9 quest area and finding ways round this stuff - it's just a chore and a nuisance and takes some of the fun out of playing, for me anyway.

Used to be up to 50 and early VR I'd expect a 3-dot or 2-dot boss to be immune to most standard effects and need people power to grind down, that's why these guys are in group dungeons or world boss areas.

But I expect 1-dot bosses or powerful creatures like trolls to be playable using the abilities I have built up over the course of playing, otherwise there seems little point in questing, skill gathering and training etc. Just stick us in at level 50 with a set of level appropriate gear and tell us there are no abilities available, just go out and try not to die too often

lecarcajou_ESO

Irritating, but not terribly. What bugs me is that I can't drink Daedric blood, especially when I'm in Coldharbour. I mean, what could the problem be?

Shaun98ca2

You know its sad I found a game that found a "solution" to this. While MOST boss monsters are typically immune to CC effects, this unnamed game made it so while you cant just cast and stun, you COULD stun it just took a lot more effort due to it being stronger in general.

lecarcajou_ESO

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

You know its sad I found a game that found a "solution" to this. While MOST boss monsters are typically immune to CC effects, this unnamed game made it so while you cant just cast and stun, you COULD stun it just took a lot more effort due to it being stronger in general.

Why so cryptic? I'd love to try this game you speak of. A hint, maybe?

Sakiri

lecarcajou_ESO wrote: »

Irritating, but not terribly. What bugs me is that I can't drink Daedric blood, especially when I'm in Coldharbour. I mean, what could the problem be?

I cant eat daedra either. Youd thnk I wouldnt be picky but I cant eat beasts as well.

At least Skyrim I could eat beasts and I could perk to eat anything.

Daedra are supposedly poisonous but as a vampire youre already dead....

Istyar

Limitless wrote: »

Zenimax wants you to group up with your guildmates, friends, or random people in VR zones to get stuff done.
They're all flowing with the population to do so, right?

Right?

So, everytime I want to play I have to ask someone to play with me? No, thanks.

reggielee

I hear ya on this, it it strange that when you really need those skills on a tough boss/elite you cant. The worst bit you only find out during combat, when you either die or successfully run off so you can reslot whatever mix of skills WILL work for that mob. Now do this over .. and over.

ArRashid

I don't really get that either.... especially after being able to stagger friggin Dragons in Skyrim

Wifeaggro13

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

I am getting a little sick of everything I face in VR triggering this message when I try to engage it.

Snare.... Target is too powerful for this effect
Snare with Ultimate... Target is too powerful for this effect
Stun.... Target is too powerful for this effect
Stun with Ultimate... Target is too powerful for this effect
Sparks... Target is too powerful for this effect
And on and on and on.... Target is too powerful for this effect

What is the purpose of making us earn skills to learn and level if when the chips are down they are useless and we are left relying on light hits, dodging, reflexes and luck?

I might as well be running around naked with a letter opener instead of wasting time creating a character build because every Target is too powerful for this effect....

Is this just a melee/NB problem based on the hatred the devs feel for us or do Templars, Sorcs & DKs get the same grief?

Its every class my friend. but is running naked with a letter opener any fun? I was thinking of trying that or wildstar which do you suggest?

PBpsy

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

I am getting a little sick of everything I face in VR triggering this message when I try to engage it.

Snare.... Target is too powerful for this effect
Snare with Ultimate... Target is too powerful for this effect
Stun.... Target is too powerful for this effect
Stun with Ultimate... Target is too powerful for this effect
Sparks... Target is too powerful for this effect
And on and on and on.... Target is too powerful for this effect

What is the purpose of making us earn skills to learn and level if when the chips are down they are useless and we are left relying on light hits, dodging, reflexes and luck?

I might as well be running around naked with a letter opener instead of wasting time creating a character build because every Target is too powerful for this effect....

Is this just a melee/NB problem based on the hatred the devs feel for us or do Templars, Sorcs & DKs get the same grief?

Its every class my friend. but is running naked with a letter opener any fun? I was thinking of trying that or wildstar which do you suggest?

Running naked up and down the stairs with two sharp knives IRL.

Wifeaggro13

PBpsy wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

I am getting a little sick of everything I face in VR triggering this message when I try to engage it.

Snare.... Target is too powerful for this effect
Snare with Ultimate... Target is too powerful for this effect
Stun.... Target is too powerful for this effect
Stun with Ultimate... Target is too powerful for this effect
Sparks... Target is too powerful for this effect
And on and on and on.... Target is too powerful for this effect

What is the purpose of making us earn skills to learn and level if when the chips are down they are useless and we are left relying on light hits, dodging, reflexes and luck?

I might as well be running around naked with a letter opener instead of wasting time creating a character build because every Target is too powerful for this effect....

Is this just a melee/NB problem based on the hatred the devs feel for us or do Templars, Sorcs & DKs get the same grief?

Its every class my friend. but is running naked with a letter opener any fun? I was thinking of trying that or wildstar which do you suggest?

Running naked up and down the stairs with two sharp knives IRL.

Thanks ill give it a try im thinking of adding a blindfold, the Dev team seems fond of them.

dodgehopper_ESO

Its annoying, and other classes deal with it. Even more infuriating is when an ability is nothing but control effect, and it does that to you, or you've morphed to add a damage effect onto it and the damage effect never gets a chance to fire because you can't even target the enemy.

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO

Brasseurfb16_ESO wrote: »

The only thing killing me in those immunities is the fact you can poison Daedric creatures and burn Flame Atronauchs but yet, halve of the freaking creatures in the game are immune to bleeds wich are a source of extra dps in some of your weapon skill lines.

It just makes no sense at all... Oh and undead and plant like creatures get extra damage and a stun from fire dmg but I haven't seen anything similar with the other elements available to players... Why is that so?

This right here. Immunities need to make sense WITHIN the context of the Elder Scrolls lore.

I think they've done vampires/werewolves correctly with their vulnerabilities to fire/poison, but NPCs and bosses need to follow the same pattern. I like the idea that flying creatures can avoid snares, but we need more specificity along these lines.

For example, if you blast a Flame Atronach with a fire staff, one of two things should happen: either nothing at all, or the Atronach should be healed for a small bit.

Unloading on that same Flame Atronach with a frost staff should hurt a bit more.

The combat is already pretty strategic in this game. I personally love it, and it fits my neural wiring better than any game I've tried thus far (looking at YOU, Wildstar). But if the NPC/Boss vulnerabilities/immunities were tweaked and made more specific like they are in previous titles, I feel it would add yet another beautiful dimension to an already amazing game.

PBpsy

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

PBpsy wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

I am getting a little sick of everything I face in VR triggering this message when I try to engage it.

Snare.... Target is too powerful for this effect
Snare with Ultimate... Target is too powerful for this effect
Stun.... Target is too powerful for this effect
Stun with Ultimate... Target is too powerful for this effect
Sparks... Target is too powerful for this effect
And on and on and on.... Target is too powerful for this effect

What is the purpose of making us earn skills to learn and level if when the chips are down they are useless and we are left relying on light hits, dodging, reflexes and luck?

I might as well be running around naked with a letter opener instead of wasting time creating a character build because every Target is too powerful for this effect....

Is this just a melee/NB problem based on the hatred the devs feel for us or do Templars, Sorcs & DKs get the same grief?

Its every class my friend. but is running naked with a letter opener any fun? I was thinking of trying that or wildstar which do you suggest?

Running naked up and down the stairs with two sharp knives IRL.

Thanks ill give it a try im thinking of adding a blindfold, the Dev team seems fond of them.

Oh yeah that would be even better. Try it soon though, I am certain the blindfolds will be nerfed to the ground in the next patch.

Sakiri

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO wrote: »

Brasseurfb16_ESO wrote: »

The only thing killing me in those immunities is the fact you can poison Daedric creatures and burn Flame Atronauchs but yet, halve of the freaking creatures in the game are immune to bleeds wich are a source of extra dps in some of your weapon skill lines.

It just makes no sense at all... Oh and undead and plant like creatures get extra damage and a stun from fire dmg but I haven't seen anything similar with the other elements available to players... Why is that so?

This right here. Immunities need to make sense WITHIN the context of the Elder Scrolls lore.

I think they've done vampires/werewolves correctly with their vulnerabilities to fire/poison, but NPCs and bosses need to follow the same pattern. I like the idea that flying creatures can avoid snares, but we need more specificity along these lines.

For example, if you blast a Flame Atronach with a fire staff, one of two things should happen: either nothing at all, or the Atronach should be healed for a small bit.

Unloading on that same Flame Atronach with a frost staff should hurt a bit more.

The combat is already pretty strategic in this game. I personally love it, and it fits my neural wiring better than any game I've tried thus far (looking at YOU, Wildstar). But if the NPC/Boss vulnerabilities/immunities were tweaked and made more specific like they are in previous titles, I feel it would add yet another beautiful dimension to an already amazing game.

They won't do something like that (the fire atronach thing) because of the way that some classes are tilted to certain types of damage.

For example, all three trees of Dragonknight skills incorporate fire damage.

Templar's Dawns Wrath tree incorporates fire damage.

Sorcerer has an entire tree dedicated to lightning, and the Daedric summoning ultimate is a Storm Atronach.

Brasseurfb16_ESO

Sakiri wrote: »

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO wrote: »

Brasseurfb16_ESO wrote: »

The only thing killing me in those immunities is the fact you can poison Daedric creatures and burn Flame Atronauchs but yet, halve of the freaking creatures in the game are immune to bleeds wich are a source of extra dps in some of your weapon skill lines.

It just makes no sense at all... Oh and undead and plant like creatures get extra damage and a stun from fire dmg but I haven't seen anything similar with the other elements available to players... Why is that so?

This right here. Immunities need to make sense WITHIN the context of the Elder Scrolls lore.

I think they've done vampires/werewolves correctly with their vulnerabilities to fire/poison, but NPCs and bosses need to follow the same pattern. I like the idea that flying creatures can avoid snares, but we need more specificity along these lines.

For example, if you blast a Flame Atronach with a fire staff, one of two things should happen: either nothing at all, or the Atronach should be healed for a small bit.

Unloading on that same Flame Atronach with a frost staff should hurt a bit more.

The combat is already pretty strategic in this game. I personally love it, and it fits my neural wiring better than any game I've tried thus far (looking at YOU, Wildstar). But if the NPC/Boss vulnerabilities/immunities were tweaked and made more specific like they are in previous titles, I feel it would add yet another beautiful dimension to an already amazing game.

They won't do something like that (the fire atronach thing) because of the way that some classes are tilted to certain types of damage.

For example, all three trees of Dragonknight skills incorporate fire damage.

Templar's Dawns Wrath tree incorporates fire damage.

Sorcerer has an entire tree dedicated to lightning, and the Daedric summoning ultimate is a Storm Atronach.

Than why do it for Bleeds?

You either choose resistance for particular ennemies with all the different types of attack in the game or you don't do it at all.

Right now we got one and only element wich dominate every other because it has some extra effect, beside the status effect (wich is the burning), wich can literaly melt 1/4 of a VR zombies health and stun them for the same occasion.
- frost only has frozen (a snare, no extra dmg dmg spike),
- poison has poisoned (DoT, no extra spike there),
- lightning has concusion (Dmg debuff, still no extra spike),
- disease has diseased (Healing debuff, no spikes there either).

Why does fire damage get a special threatement while the other elements, especialy bleeds, get the short end of the stick???

If the devs realy want to start balancing their game they should start either by nerfing fire damage unique effect to the ground or buff the other elements to the same level of effect against some different encounters.

Shaun98ca2

lecarcajou_ESO wrote: »

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

You know its sad I found a game that found a "solution" to this. While MOST boss monsters are typically immune to CC effects, this unnamed game made it so while you cant just cast and stun, you COULD stun it just took a lot more effort due to it being stronger in general.

Why so cryptic? I'd love to try this game you speak of. A hint, maybe?

Cant "promote" other games on this website. You PROBABLY wont like the answer either. Its the only game that is in direct competition with this one.

Sakiri

Im not arguing with you on bleeds, Im saying why they wont fark with magic immunities.

WoW I mentioned had this problem for years, and they changed it real quick when Wrath hit.

Stone, mechanical, undead all immune to disease. Here lets add a class that almost exclusively deals disease damage!

Same with bleeds when they made bear tanks and cat dps druids reliant on bleeds(damage increased on bleeding targets, mangle increases bleeding damage). Couldnt have half the mobs immune. Why take a feral?

Damage immunities look nice on paper but suck in practice. Cleave sucks. Why? Beside the high cost, its damage is mostly dot bleed that half the creatures in game are immune to!

dodgehopper_ESO

Whoever said Werewolf is balanced is just wrong. Its far too many skillpoints expended for mostly weakness. I will list out the good with the bad.

Good:
1) You can turn into a Werewolf. Yay.
2) Werewolf form has decent Melee damage.
3) Small boost to ultimate building for getting hit in combat.

Bad:
1) Wolf form is far too brief. If someone runs ahead of you and starts clearing mobs, you turn back into human far too quickly.
2) Devour (the thing that helps you stay in wolf form) only works on normal people and some animals. It is also easily broken.
3) Devour has a minimum distance you must kill something from the last animal you devoured or it doesn't count.
4) Transformation into Wolf form makes you a big target to get beat on.
5) Transformation out of Wolf form makes you a big target to get beat on.
6) Transformation often locks up, so that you can't use your abilities in either wolf or human form.
7) Wolf form damage is not worthy of an ultimate, certainly not an ultimate of that magnitude.
8) I find I'm more survivable and do better damage in Human form.
9) You get Poison weakness in all forms. Why? Not only is this not in the lore, but it doesn't even make sense in terms of balance.
10) You're weak to Fighters guild abilities in all forms.
11) The skill point investment of Werewolf is high, with very little return on investment.
12) Wolf form is highly susceptible to control effects, not only because it is a melee only class, but because it has no proper cc breaker like others.

Taken in balance, what do you think about being a werewolf now? Its fun, but even on fun factor alone the duration of the form really detracts from wanting to play a wolf. Its hard to have fun when you can only be a wolf for a very short duration. If the devouring function were additive, it might be a little more fun (like in Skyrim), and if they either removed the poison weakness or added utility to the human form it might be more fun. As it is, this is purely for the laughs of playing a Werewolf (which I have one) but it is by far not a balanced Skill line, and on the balance a massive negative to your character not a positive.

Sakiri

I have three wolves. Might have two more.

WW needs work. See sig.

cigarsmoker

irishdexy wrote: »

Some Bosses and mini bosses have this immunity to snares. I get it on my Sorc and on my DK as well as my NB.

It's not just mini-bosses. Anything 'Large' seems to have this immunity.

Because Nightblades rely on their extra effects a lot more than other classes we get screwed a lot more.

Singular

Brasseurfb16_ESO wrote: »

The only thing killing me in those immunities is the fact you can poison Daedric creatures and burn Flame Atronauchs but yet, halve of the freaking creatures in the game are immune to bleeds wich are a source of extra dps in some of your weapon skill lines.

It just makes no sense at all... Oh and undead and plant like creatures get extra damage and a stun from fire dmg but I haven't seen anything similar with the other elements available to players... Why is that so?

Totally agree with you. I couldn't figure out why the fire creatures take damage from fire.

I guess b/c we're ... hurling it at them? No idea. You'd think their health would go up.