The 1v1 that went for 10 minutes straight....

SuperJChat

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

ViciousWayz wrote: »

I as a Nightblade, have not had this problem. Were you many levels lower than he/she?

Same level, dk fights are usually fine but some of them are just a brick wall you are trying to break down with a plunger....

My only Questions:

1. what race are you
2. how did you spec your attributes
3. what quality and type (Heavy/Medium/Light, and how many of each) of gear were you using (sets or no, if yes list)
4. Anything more specific you can tell us about the DK in question (race, armor type, weapons used, skills used, anything)

glitchmaster999

Baphomet wrote: »

Ah, that tactic work for all classes, though, not just DKs. Grab a sword + shield and switch on tank mode, let the enemy deplete all of his resources, then strike back.

With the nightblade class it is sword + shield, swallow soul, sap essence, crippling grasp, veil of blades and then block your enemy to death.

That's great except I wasn't out of resources hahaha

zgrssd wrote: »

The 1v1 that went for 10 minutes straight....

Yes, Classes are not fully balanced yet. Thanks Captain Obvious.

I expected misbalances to exist in a new game, especially a MMO.
I also expect the bulk to be solved within the first 6 months after launch. We recentyl started the 3rd month. With it never being fully free of them (because MMO are just too complex to have 100% balance and bug freeness).

Once again, I did say that I don't really care all that much, I don't PVP much it was just hilarious that it can happen. Thank you captain condescending for showing your presence.

xsfkxnub19_ESO wrote: »

720dps? I need your build info I can barely hit 400 LOL

I run warlock build, I know magicka stick build.... I don't like it either... you use crippling strike, strife, magelight, assassins blade and either siphoning strikes (my prefered) or equillibrium. Before I changed I was hitting up to 500 with my bow build (still using crippling strike) after the change, have seen 20 second fights got at 900 dps single target with potions and ult and I still dont even have spell crit passive for light armor.

glitchmaster999

SuperJChat wrote: »

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

ViciousWayz wrote: »

I as a Nightblade, have not had this problem. Were you many levels lower than he/she?

Same level, dk fights are usually fine but some of them are just a brick wall you are trying to break down with a plunger....

My only Questions:

1. what race are you
2. how did you spec your attributes
3. what quality and type (Heavy/Medium/Light, and how many of each) of gear were you using (sets or no, if yes list)
4. Anything more specific you can tell us about the DK in question (race, armor type, weapons used, skills used, anything)

Sorry didn't see that, I am a wood elf nightblade with overcharged magicka and health just under over charged. I just respecced into full light with a resto staff. I used reapers mark, snipe, shadow ult, assassins ult, crippling grasp, strife, assassins blade, inner light and siphoning attacks.

He was an orc dragonknight in full heavy armor with sword and board/ destro staff. He was using green dragonblood, standard, the shield jump thing, reflect spell thing, the destro staff magicka back on fire damage thing and a couple of other spells that I can't remember.

wpitterlb14a_ESO

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

Baphomet wrote: »

Nightblades and sorcerers don't need the same kind of self heals as dragonknights and templars do because they have the ability to break combat instead. How does this continiue to elude people?

In PvP, they have the best burst damage and the best escape mechanisms but people still want them have top tier healing, too? Really?

@Brian_Wheeler promise me that you don't give in to this nonsense.

Don't even...

I watch *** turtletanks kill 3 people (granted, a lot of them don't dodge roll/BE in time to avoid bannertalons) 1v3 regularly. I almost never see any other class do this unless extremely outlevel/gearing the others. Burst damage means *** when you can hold block forever and regen forever so you can block while casting instant (this really needs a nerf imo, more than anything). Also, DKs can do crazy burst dmg with a 2H or staff, so I don't get your point. Why escape when you can just facetank and kill everything?

You negate ALL ranged damage for large periods of time. Second best self heal in the game AND stam regen so you can continue blocking indefinitely (20s, seriously? wtf is this). Talons cannot be blocked and I can't break stun while in talons, one of your ults is basically 'cheat death', and you have a toggleable perma-aoe, an aoe snare/blind and a knockdown. You can pull people off keeps and leap ON TOP of keeps.

Balanced set of abilities, right?

Dear god you are so full of it...

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

I watch *** turtletanks kill 3 people (granted, a lot of them don't dodge roll/BE in time to avoid bannertalons) 1v3 regularly.

I love how you gloss over this little tidbit like its not even important. Banner and talons are literally nothing but wasted ability slots and resources if people just roll the hell out of them. Talons does 199 physical damage on initial hit, with a mana cost of 420. Hardly effective with a radius that barely exceeds melee range. If you're stupid enough to stand in it, you deserve to die. If you ran out of stamina and can no longer dodge roll, you are just as much of a sitting duck against any other class. No dodge roll, no cc break, no blocking = dead.

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

Burst damage means *** when you can hold block forever and regen forever so you can block while casting instant (this really needs a nerf imo, more than anything).

What is this magical infinitely sustainable regen you are referring to? For magicka we've got Sea of Flames and Draw Essence. Neither of which are viable sources of actual regen, they merely provide a chance to regain some of the cost of the spell itself.

We have exactly one ability that provides stamina, Green Dragon Blood. Gives a 30% boost to stam regen for 20s. My char is currently sitting at VR12 with 77 base stam regen, which is 1 above the soft cap. Guess what that 30% stam boost does for me - raises my stam regen from 77 to 86. I know what you're thinking - omg thats so powerful! Right? No? Weird. So for 20 seconds, I gain an additional 9 stamina every two seconds, or 4.5 stamina every second, for a total of 90 stamina over the course of the 20 second duration. Hot diggity damn, what am I do to with all of that overflowing stam regen?!

Health regen is even more of a joke, I'm not even going to waste time showing you the numbers.

But wait, lets not forget the passives. I get some hp, magicka and stamina whenever I drop my standard. A whopping 340. Better than nothing sure, but not enough to cast even one GDB (or talons) or two Venom Arrows. It'll give me a few more seconds of blocking, sure, but nothing near enough to be able to make it to my next standard drop, especially if I'm being hit by multiple opponents (and if I'm only fighting one opponent, its going to take a hell of a lot more stamina than that to get back to 200 ultimate). The point is it's not sustainable.

Then I've got Helping Hands which gives me 5% stamina whenever I cast an Earthen Heart ability. At 2000 stamina thats 100 stamina per cast, so best case scenario I'm spamming Molten Weapons (280 base magicka) to trade my magicka for stamina at a rate of 1 stamina per 2.8 magicka (and the ratio gets worse the less stamina you have, which includes almost everybody). Now ignoring for a minute that its completely useless to spam Molten Weapons over and over since its a minute long buff (even if you took Molten Armaments the crit buff lasts 6 seconds, not exactly spam territory there either), and assuming I also have an unreasonably high 2000 magicka, I could cast it 7 times before running out, netting me a grand total of 700 stamina, while simultaneously robbing myself of the ability to cast anything else. Doesn't seem like a worthwhile trade to me, especially considering that I'll likely have lost a decent chunk of it from blocking all the incoming attacks over the course of the time it takes me to spam a useless spell 7 times.

So please, enlighten me as to which Dragon Knight abilities are giving us infinite regen. I'm all ears.

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

Also, DKs can do crazy burst dmg with a 2H or staff, so I don't get your point. Why escape when you can just facetank and kill everything?

You are missing the point. Nobody was asking for DK's to be given an escape ability. The other poster was simply stating that DK's have this very powerful self heal because they don't have an escape like nightblades and sorcs. What do you think the DK class would look like if they just straight removed Dragon Blood tomorrow? No combat stealth, no teleport, no heals, no ranged damage. They would instantly drop into Templar status (in pvp at least, GDB isn't quite as critical in pve). Of our 18 class abilities (including ultimates), 8 of them have a range of 10m or less (or only affect targets within a range of 10m or less). Our longest range ability is one of our ultimates, Dragon Leap morphed to Take Flight clocking in at 28m, which oh by the way puts you into melee range with your enemies. Following that is Fiery Grip morphed to Extended Chains, clocking in at a whopping 22m, then Stonefist morphed to Obsidian Shard at 15m. Note that all three of these abilities require taking a morph that increases their range to even achieve these mediocre numbers, and that none of them are actually useful at dealing burst or sustained damage at range.

Now I'm not saying that you, or anyone else here, is actually suggesting that GDB be literally removed from the game. I bring it up only to point out the absurdity of complaining that DK's were given a powerful self heal. The class is designed from the ground up to do damage at close range. I understand that Nightblades are in a similar boat on this count, but thats why they have instant combat stealth. Take that away from Nightblades and it'd have the same effect as removing GDB from DK's - instant scrub status.

Point being, different classes are different. Nobody was saying DK's need to be given an escape as well, but their lack of an escape essentially requires that they be given something else in compensation, which is survivability. We can argue that they have too much survivability, but smart people understand that this is largely due to things other than their class skills.

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

You negate ALL ranged damage for large periods of time.

This is a fair complaint. I'm pretty sure that Reflective Scale is not working as intended though. The tool tip states that its only supposed to reflect spell projectiles, and from what I understand it functions that way in pve. Its only in pvp that it also reflects non-spell projectiles (bow light/heavy attacks, bow abilities, etc). When it gets fixed it'll be of much more situational usefulness. It might need more adjustments even then, but I doubt it.

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

Second best self heal in the game AND stam regen so you can continue blocking indefinitely (20s, seriously? wtf is this).

I've already covered the ridiculous complaints about the stam regen above. No need to go over it again.

Lets be honest with each other here okay? Yes, GDB has the potential to heal for the second highest amount amongst all instant cast / instant effect heals. But if we're going to start ranking heals lets look at the whole picture.

1. It only heals based on health missing, which makes getting anywhere near the full 33% heal extremely dangerous. More often than not you are casting this around the 50% mark, and on rare occasions down around the 25% mark. At 50% health its only healing you for 16.5% of your total health, at 25% its healing you for about 24% of your total health. With 3000 total health those heals are coming in at 495 and 720 respectively. Pretty powerful as far as instant heals go? Sure. Overwhelmingly overpowered? No.
2. Spamming GDB consecutively is inefficient. This is due to the above mechanic. If you're sitting at 25% hp and you cast it twice back to back you get healed for 720 and then 505 on the second cast. You're still only up to about 65% of your total health at this point, and then the third cast will only heal for 338, about 11% of your total health. Not so hot anymore is it. Getting those powerful heals out of GDB requires risk, timing, and sometimes a bit of luck.
3. GDB can't crit. I'm pretty sure this isn't a bug either. It just isn't supposed to crit, and it probably never will. Rushed Ceremony can reach much higher numbers with crits than GDB ever will, and Blessing of Protection crits start creeping into the higher range of GDB heals. Not to mention both of those abilities have much more useful additional effects.
4. GDB is a self heal only. This is pretty self-explanatory, but it needs to be mentioned, since both of the heals its commonly compared to can be cast on other players and even heal other players at the same time as it heals the caster.

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

Talons cannot be blocked and I can't break stun while in talons

The inability to break some stuns while affected by other forms of CC is generally believe to be a bug. It only started happening after the Craglorn patch, and it doesn't seem to be entirely consistent either. Its not just talons that causes it either. My own experience tells me just about any combination of multiple types of CC's causes it. This is not a DK issue.

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

one of your ults is basically 'cheat death'

I don't even know which ult you are referring to here. Standard or Magma Armor I'd have to guess, but certainly neither one of these allow you to cheat death, only to get beat on for a little while longer. Standard has already had its damage boost and damage received bonuses lowered, and if the PTS patch notes are to be believed its going to receive even more nerfs soon. Magma Armor is getting its duration lowered. Either way, neither of these are get out of jail free cards. They both require you to remain engaged in the battle, a battle that you are apparently already losing if your goal is to 'cheat death' with your ultimate. Oh and, you know, its an ultimate, unlike shadow cloak and bolt escape.

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

and you have a toggleable perma-aoe, an aoe snare/blind and a knockdown.

I don't even know what to say. We have skills that do things. You mad? That 'perma-aoe' does crap damage and does in fact cost magicka to maintain. I can count on one finger the number of players I've encountered that actually use Ash Cloud. Both of those skills by the way are melee range. They don't affect anyone who isn't close enough to smack with a sword. Yea we have a knockdown, amazing, so does every other class as well as several of the weapon skill lines.

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

Balanced set of abilities, right?

Look man, you describe all of this *** as if we can actually slot all of these abilities at the same time and spam them without ever running out of magicka. You talk as if I can simultaneously spam Reflective Scales to be permanently invincible to ranged attacks, while spamming Green Dragons Blood to instantly heal all incoming damage, while spamming talons to perma root everyone around me, while keeping two AoE abilities running and casting my ult willy nilly. And somewhere in there I apparently have room for my knockdown and some 2h or staff abilities as well.

It doesn't work like that. We have a finite amount of magicka just like everyone else, and no class skills to regen it.

Baphomet

Thank you. That post saved me a lot of time having to explain some of the basics of the games.

Thechemicals

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

I am a nightblade dps, my build has siphoning strikes and strife in it.

I met a dragonknight in bruma, I came out of sneak with my full dps kit and he healed it off, I sniped to reduce healing, he still healed it off. It was literally me beating on him watching him auto attack me and get his mana back while tanking the 720 dps I could dish out. When he got bored of tanking me, he ulted, shield bashed me and then burst me down in a matter of seconds.....

To all the people that say dragonknights are fine, they have been nerfed into the ground. I would agree except for the damage that they do while still being invincible is unbelievable. I was on a roll in bruma, I got my 19th player kill from 1v1 encounters and then this.

I'm not mad about it, it was kind of funny, he even sat on my smoldering corpse but there still seems to be a bit of a balance problem if he can literally stand there and never die.

So you went 19-1 and someone finally smashed your build into pieces and based on this personal experience, you feel that Dk's are imbalanced. Maybe take a look at what you were missing in that fight.By your description, you had zero defense/escapes/ohshit buttons if he dps'd you down in seconds. Also, you said you had strife, a low/moderate damage healing attack so im guessing this is what you spammed. That skill is not going to get you any real damage with siphonings penalty against a shield tank using dragonblood. You were basically playing his game and hoping your medium/light armor and heals would beat his Shield mitigation and healing. Of course you werent going to win. He was a good player and likely toy'd with you.What happened here is you didnt change your tactics. Gratz on 90%+ win ratio though, seems you did really well overrall, which makes this thread kinda a buzzkill.

glitchmaster999

Thechemicals wrote: »

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

I am a nightblade dps, my build has siphoning strikes and strife in it.

I met a dragonknight in bruma, I came out of sneak with my full dps kit and he healed it off, I sniped to reduce healing, he still healed it off. It was literally me beating on him watching him auto attack me and get his mana back while tanking the 720 dps I could dish out. When he got bored of tanking me, he ulted, shield bashed me and then burst me down in a matter of seconds.....

To all the people that say dragonknights are fine, they have been nerfed into the ground. I would agree except for the damage that they do while still being invincible is unbelievable. I was on a roll in bruma, I got my 19th player kill from 1v1 encounters and then this.

I'm not mad about it, it was kind of funny, he even sat on my smoldering corpse but there still seems to be a bit of a balance problem if he can literally stand there and never die.

So you went 19-1 and someone finally smashed your build into pieces and based on this personal experience, you feel that Dk's are imbalanced. Maybe take a look at what you were missing in that fight.By your description, you had zero defense/escapes/ohshit buttons if he dps'd you down in seconds. Also, you said you had strife, a low/moderate damage healing attack so im guessing this is what you spammed. That skill is not going to get you any real damage with siphonings penalty against a shield tank using dragonblood. You were basically playing his game and hoping your medium/light armor and heals would beat his Shield mitigation and healing. Of course you werent going to win. He was a good player and likely toy'd with you.What happened here is you didnt change your tactics. Gratz on 90%+ win ratio though, seems you did really well overrall, which makes this thread kinda a buzzkill.

Once again,this thread was not complaining dk's are broken, they are after all meant to be the best tanks, I think they are a bit more powerful than they should be particularly with the damage side of things but still.

His armor was reduced by 75% and he had reduced healing. My strife hits for 600, that's not moderate/low, that's the highest damage skill nightblades get. 700 dps without good sets or food is really damn good, I also have near unlimited resources with siphoning strikes, so he should of run out of stamina or magicka before I ran out of anything but despite people saying "dragonknights are only good while they have magicka" he also just casts one destro staff ability and then gets his mana back with unstable flames or some other fire move.

The highest sustained single target I have seen in this game is 900, I am getting 700, if that isn't enough to kill a tank that has reduced armor and reduced healing, that is the definition of unbalanced. I think dragonknights should be amazing tanks, but the fact they are getting unbelievable resource regeneration means that they can tank forever and then still dish out unbelievable damage. I agree that its only certain parts of dragonknights that are overpowered, my brother plays a dragonknight and he says that his stamina dual wield build has no survivability.

Don't come here and tell me i'm playing wrong if I can't kill him... this build should destroy tanks, less armor, less healing and high burst ( bouts of 1000dps with ult up) and it felt like throwing a cotton ball at a brick wall.. yeah its really the build thats the problem.

Also define good player, because FOTM builds take out all the skill of building a character and blocking is as basic as it gets, so where is the skill? Running a build that he found on the internet because it operates overpowered mechanics?

Teevesnacks

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

I am a nightblade dps, my build has siphoning strikes and strife in it.

I met a dragonknight in bruma, I came out of sneak with my full dps kit and he healed it off, I sniped to reduce healing, he still healed it off. It was literally me beating on him watching him auto attack me and get his mana back while tanking the 720 dps I could dish out. When he got bored of tanking me, he ulted, shield bashed me and then burst me down in a matter of seconds.....

To all the people that say dragonknights are fine, they have been nerfed into the ground. I would agree except for the damage that they do while still being invincible is unbelievable. I was on a roll in bruma, I got my 19th player kill from 1v1 encounters and then this.

I'm not mad about it, it was kind of funny, he even sat on my smoldering corpse but there still seems to be a bit of a balance problem if he can literally stand there and never die.

This story is false

I was that DK in bruma that he met

He opened up from stealth and took almost half my HP away, I popped a HP pot and proceeded to block and find out where he was attacking me from, I was using a pve build at the time and didn't have any CC's, but I did have green dragon blood to keep me up for a bit, after he depleted my stamina from blocking he started to close in and when he was in melee ranged he used shadowy disguise and used veiled strike which did a fair amount of damage and stunned me, I was basically out of stamina to break it, he used shadowy disguise again and must of hit me with a death stroke because from that point on my green dragon blood at low hp couldn't save me

As I lay there checking out my death recap, he proceed to have a tea party on my corpse(if you know what I mean)

Eivar

I love how so many people say, "a Nightblade can just invis, and escape battle". Don't get me wrong a skilled nightblade CAN use invis to escape a LOT of situations, but the sheer number of things that negate stealth/invis is absolutely ridiculous, magelight, detection potions, tapping a light attack in the general direction a NB was traveling, the "in combat" bug, a dk's/sorcs PbAoE aura, combine that with dark cloak not removing every dot that it should, and the bug of Nb's own dot/dots breaking stealth. I'e even had to sit through like 5 mins of stealth pulsing on and off with no see through stealth mobs within sight. There absolutely need to be counters to stealth/invis, but comparing a dks survivability to a nbs easily negated stealth seems a bit off balanced to me. In general though all I'm looking for is a fix to non staff dps, and a bit of an increase to nbs survivability, whether it's through improved stealth mechanics or self heals i don't care. All i know is it's incredibly frustrating to be able to almost one shot a mob with a sneak attack-concealed weapon, then to use that same opener on a player and rather than do a significant amount of damage, you see maybe a 5% drop, and then they start blocking, lol.

thelg

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

Thechemicals wrote: »

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

I am a nightblade dps, my build has siphoning strikes and strife in it.

I met a dragonknight in bruma, I came out of sneak with my full dps kit and he healed it off, I sniped to reduce healing, he still healed it off. It was literally me beating on him watching him auto attack me and get his mana back while tanking the 720 dps I could dish out. When he got bored of tanking me, he ulted, shield bashed me and then burst me down in a matter of seconds.....

To all the people that say dragonknights are fine, they have been nerfed into the ground. I would agree except for the damage that they do while still being invincible is unbelievable. I was on a roll in bruma, I got my 19th player kill from 1v1 encounters and then this.

I'm not mad about it, it was kind of funny, he even sat on my smoldering corpse but there still seems to be a bit of a balance problem if he can literally stand there and never die.

So you went 19-1 and someone finally smashed your build into pieces and based on this personal experience, you feel that Dk's are imbalanced. Maybe take a look at what you were missing in that fight.By your description, you had zero defense/escapes/ohshit buttons if he dps'd you down in seconds. Also, you said you had strife, a low/moderate damage healing attack so im guessing this is what you spammed. That skill is not going to get you any real damage with siphonings penalty against a shield tank using dragonblood. You were basically playing his game and hoping your medium/light armor and heals would beat his Shield mitigation and healing. Of course you werent going to win. He was a good player and likely toy'd with you.What happened here is you didnt change your tactics. Gratz on 90%+ win ratio though, seems you did really well overrall, which makes this thread kinda a buzzkill.

Once again,this thread was not complaining dk's are broken, they are after all meant to be the best tanks, I think they are a bit more powerful than they should be particularly with the damage side of things but still.

His armor was reduced by 75% and he had reduced healing. My strife hits for 600, that's not moderate/low, that's the highest damage skill nightblades get. 700 dps without good sets or food is really damn good, I also have near unlimited resources with siphoning strikes, so he should of run out of stamina or magicka before I ran out of anything but despite people saying "dragonknights are only good while they have magicka" he also just casts one destro staff ability and then gets his mana back with unstable flames or some other fire move.

The highest sustained single target I have seen in this game is 900, I am getting 700, if that isn't enough to kill a tank that has reduced armor and reduced healing, that is the definition of unbalanced. I think dragonknights should be amazing tanks, but the fact they are getting unbelievable resource regeneration means that they can tank forever and then still dish out unbelievable damage. I agree that its only certain parts of dragonknights that are overpowered, my brother plays a dragonknight and he says that his stamina dual wield build has no survivability.

Don't come here and tell me i'm playing wrong if I can't kill him... this build should destroy tanks, less armor, less healing and high burst ( bouts of 1000dps with ult up) and it felt like throwing a cotton ball at a brick wall.. yeah its really the build thats the problem.

Also define good player, because FOTM builds take out all the skill of building a character and blocking is as basic as it gets, so where is the skill? Running a build that he found on the internet because it operates overpowered mechanics?

So you are saying you are OP and need nerfing. Did I get that right?

Teevesnacks

thelg wrote: »

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

Thechemicals wrote: »

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

I am a nightblade dps, my build has siphoning strikes and strife in it.

I met a dragonknight in bruma, I came out of sneak with my full dps kit and he healed it off, I sniped to reduce healing, he still healed it off. It was literally me beating on him watching him auto attack me and get his mana back while tanking the 720 dps I could dish out. When he got bored of tanking me, he ulted, shield bashed me and then burst me down in a matter of seconds.....

To all the people that say dragonknights are fine, they have been nerfed into the ground. I would agree except for the damage that they do while still being invincible is unbelievable. I was on a roll in bruma, I got my 19th player kill from 1v1 encounters and then this.

I'm not mad about it, it was kind of funny, he even sat on my smoldering corpse but there still seems to be a bit of a balance problem if he can literally stand there and never die.

So you went 19-1 and someone finally smashed your build into pieces and based on this personal experience, you feel that Dk's are imbalanced. Maybe take a look at what you were missing in that fight.By your description, you had zero defense/escapes/ohshit buttons if he dps'd you down in seconds. Also, you said you had strife, a low/moderate damage healing attack so im guessing this is what you spammed. That skill is not going to get you any real damage with siphonings penalty against a shield tank using dragonblood. You were basically playing his game and hoping your medium/light armor and heals would beat his Shield mitigation and healing. Of course you werent going to win. He was a good player and likely toy'd with you.What happened here is you didnt change your tactics. Gratz on 90%+ win ratio though, seems you did really well overrall, which makes this thread kinda a buzzkill.

Once again,this thread was not complaining dk's are broken, they are after all meant to be the best tanks, I think they are a bit more powerful than they should be particularly with the damage side of things but still.

His armor was reduced by 75% and he had reduced healing. My strife hits for 600, that's not moderate/low, that's the highest damage skill nightblades get. 700 dps without good sets or food is really damn good, I also have near unlimited resources with siphoning strikes, so he should of run out of stamina or magicka before I ran out of anything but despite people saying "dragonknights are only good while they have magicka" he also just casts one destro staff ability and then gets his mana back with unstable flames or some other fire move.

The highest sustained single target I have seen in this game is 900, I am getting 700, if that isn't enough to kill a tank that has reduced armor and reduced healing, that is the definition of unbalanced. I think dragonknights should be amazing tanks, but the fact they are getting unbelievable resource regeneration means that they can tank forever and then still dish out unbelievable damage. I agree that its only certain parts of dragonknights that are overpowered, my brother plays a dragonknight and he says that his stamina dual wield build has no survivability.

Don't come here and tell me i'm playing wrong if I can't kill him... this build should destroy tanks, less armor, less healing and high burst ( bouts of 1000dps with ult up) and it felt like throwing a cotton ball at a brick wall.. yeah its really the build thats the problem.

Also define good player, because FOTM builds take out all the skill of building a character and blocking is as basic as it gets, so where is the skill? Running a build that he found on the internet because it operates overpowered mechanics?

So you are saying you are OP and need nerfing. Did I get that right?

Naaah he's saying dk's are op apparently

fambaab16_ESO

wpitterlb14a_ESO wrote: »

Health regen is even more of a joke, I'm not even going to waste time showing you the numbers.

Then tell us which skill it is that DKs use to heal from near death to 80% life 3 times in a row. Thank you.

thelg

fambaab16_ESO wrote: »

wpitterlb14a_ESO wrote: »

Health regen is even more of a joke, I'm not even going to waste time showing you the numbers.

Then tell us which skill it is that DKs use to heal from near death to 80% life 3 times in a row. Thank you.

There is not one, it's that simple. There is a big case of LEARN ABOUT OTHER CLASSES here

3k health DK uses GDB at 30%(just before being gibber with execute). He gets healed for 3000*(1-0.3)*0.33=693 DK is now at 900+693 = 1593health(not full..)

Say he uses GDB again right away. He is at 50% health at this point. 1500*0.3=450 putting him at 2k which is 2/3rds of his health.. More then that is just waste of magic. This cost him:448*2 (he was in heavy so no reduction). 900 magic.

So no DKs do NOT heal to full health automagically. However DB might ignore heal reduction, I never tested that. Would kinda make sense since it is not boosted by magic and is a flat %.

I would actually argue that Coagualting Blood is a better morph since it give you a lot of defense but you get not stamina regen increase. Basically you hit that, wait 4 seconds hit it again. etc

People just can't handle loosing. Its pathetic.

Halrloprillalar

wpitterlb14a_ESO wrote: »

snip

Light armor, cost reduction jewelry, SNB DK can have their resources refill almost indefinitely while blocking everything. And have their armor capped from spike armor.

Magma armor isn't cheat death?? LOL. Tell me another class ult that does nearly that kind of survivability (9s of it no less)? Oh and not to mention your ults regen super fast and heal/magika/stamina you up nicely.

Talons frequently hits me for >400, +dot (i'm spell resist soft capped, before you ask). Banner for 300-500 /tick. Talons has no cd. You can just invasion/talons me again if I move away (not banner, I realize) and I can't dodge roll forever. Instants are castable while blocking (which is one of the biggest oversights in the game imo, regardless of class), which means I can get whipped to death while you take no damage. If I try and nuke you down you just pop reflect or go back to turtle mode. It's a war of attrition in which DK has the upper hand due to the insane regen from ult synergy, GDB and light armor. If I *** up even a little, I'm dead. If the DK *** up, he just uses his ult or dragonblood.

DKs are the most BS class by far, in pvp at least.

pavelcherepanskyrwb17_ESO

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

Light armor, cost reduction jewelry, SNB DK can have their resources refill almost indefinitely while blocking everything. And have their armor capped from spike armor.

Magma armor isn't cheat death?? LOL. Tell me another class ult that does nearly that kind of survivability (9s of it no less)? Oh and not to mention your ults regen super fast and heal/magika/stamina you up nicely.

Talons frequently hits me for >400, +dot (i'm spell resist soft capped, before you ask). Banner for 300-500 /tick. Talons has no cd. You can just invasion/talons me again if I move away (not banner, I realize) and I can't dodge roll forever. Instants are castable while blocking (which is one of the biggest oversights in the game imo, regardless of class), which means I can get whipped to death while you take no damage. If I try and nuke you down you just pop reflect or go back to turtle mode. It's a war of attrition in which DK has the upper hand due to the insane regen from ult synergy, GDB and light armor. If I *** up even a little, I'm dead. If the DK *** up, he just uses his ult or dragonblood.

DKs are the most BS class by far, in pvp at least.

Yes, magicka regen is high but it's same for every class wearing light armor so what's your point?

With light armor or heavy armor builds you don't get a super fast ult regen, only when you're being bashed by several players at the same time and yeah, if you do survive the beating, CCs, dots and whatnot during the beating stage you do deserve to use an ultimate.

I'm not sure where you got that number for standard damage, it's ridiculous. I've never had anything above 180 dps with it after the recent nerf. If you go and do calculations on Esohead you can see that you need over 300-500 spell damage for standard to be dishing out such numbers. I think you might be delusional.

Talons have no cd? Hell yeah, but so do all other skills, again what's your point, mate? Talons have 6 meters range. That's it. Are you really saying you can't get away 6 meters? Again, a DK would need a spell damage of over 200 to deal even 400 damage with talons. I'm not sure how everyone, but I'm not at that level yet...

glitchmaster999

Teevesnacks wrote: »

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

I am a nightblade dps, my build has siphoning strikes and strife in it.

I met a dragonknight in bruma, I came out of sneak with my full dps kit and he healed it off, I sniped to reduce healing, he still healed it off. It was literally me beating on him watching him auto attack me and get his mana back while tanking the 720 dps I could dish out. When he got bored of tanking me, he ulted, shield bashed me and then burst me down in a matter of seconds.....

To all the people that say dragonknights are fine, they have been nerfed into the ground. I would agree except for the damage that they do while still being invincible is unbelievable. I was on a roll in bruma, I got my 19th player kill from 1v1 encounters and then this.

I'm not mad about it, it was kind of funny, he even sat on my smoldering corpse but there still seems to be a bit of a balance problem if he can literally stand there and never die.

This story is false

I was that DK in bruma that he met

He opened up from stealth and took almost half my HP away, I popped a HP pot and proceeded to block and find out where he was attacking me from, I was using a pve build at the time and didn't have any CC's, but I did have green dragon blood to keep me up for a bit, after he depleted my stamina from blocking he started to close in and when he was in melee ranged he used shadowy disguise and used veiled strike which did a fair amount of damage and stunned me, I was basically out of stamina to break it, he used shadowy disguise again and must of hit me with a death stroke because from that point on my green dragon blood at low hp couldn't save me

As I lay there checking out my death recap, he proceed to have a tea party on my corpse(if you know what I mean)

I don't have vailed strike, nice try....

Malmai

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

I am a nightblade dps, my build has siphoning strikes and strife in it.

I met a dragonknight in bruma, I came out of sneak with my full dps kit and he healed it off, I sniped to reduce healing, he still healed it off. It was literally me beating on him watching him auto attack me and get his mana back while tanking the 720 dps I could dish out. When he got bored of tanking me, he ulted, shield bashed me and then burst me down in a matter of seconds.....

To all the people that say dragonknights are fine, they have been nerfed into the ground. I would agree except for the damage that they do while still being invincible is unbelievable. I was on a roll in bruma, I got my 19th player kill from 1v1 encounters and then this.

I'm not mad about it, it was kind of funny, he even sat on my smoldering corpse but there still seems to be a bit of a balance problem if he can literally stand there and never die.

Maybe use some CC get him to use his Magicka (Mass Hysteria) Vol. Rune, Crippling Grasp i have no Problems...

Thechemicals

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

Thechemicals wrote: »

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

I am a nightblade dps, my build has siphoning strikes and strife in it.

I met a dragonknight in bruma, I came out of sneak with my full dps kit and he healed it off, I sniped to reduce healing, he still healed it off. It was literally me beating on him watching him auto attack me and get his mana back while tanking the 720 dps I could dish out. When he got bored of tanking me, he ulted, shield bashed me and then burst me down in a matter of seconds.....

To all the people that say dragonknights are fine, they have been nerfed into the ground. I would agree except for the damage that they do while still being invincible is unbelievable. I was on a roll in bruma, I got my 19th player kill from 1v1 encounters and then this.

I'm not mad about it, it was kind of funny, he even sat on my smoldering corpse but there still seems to be a bit of a balance problem if he can literally stand there and never die.

So you went 19-1 and someone finally smashed your build into pieces and based on this personal experience, you feel that Dk's are imbalanced. Maybe take a look at what you were missing in that fight.By your description, you had zero defense/escapes/ohshit buttons if he dps'd you down in seconds. Also, you said you had strife, a low/moderate damage healing attack so im guessing this is what you spammed. That skill is not going to get you any real damage with siphonings penalty against a shield tank using dragonblood. You were basically playing his game and hoping your medium/light armor and heals would beat his Shield mitigation and healing. Of course you werent going to win. He was a good player and likely toy'd with you.What happened here is you didnt change your tactics. Gratz on 90%+ win ratio though, seems you did really well overrall, which makes this thread kinda a buzzkill.

Once again,this thread was not complaining dk's are broken, they are after all meant to be the best tanks, I think they are a bit more powerful than they should be particularly with the damage side of things but still.

His armor was reduced by 75% and he had reduced healing. My strife hits for 600, that's not moderate/low, that's the highest damage skill nightblades get. 700 dps without good sets or food is really damn good, I also have near unlimited resources with siphoning strikes, so he should of run out of stamina or magicka before I ran out of anything but despite people saying "dragonknights are only good while they have magicka" he also just casts one destro staff ability and then gets his mana back with unstable flames or some other fire move.

The highest sustained single target I have seen in this game is 900, I am getting 700, if that isn't enough to kill a tank that has reduced armor and reduced healing, that is the definition of unbalanced. I think dragonknights should be amazing tanks, but the fact they are getting unbelievable resource regeneration means that they can tank forever and then still dish out unbelievable damage. I agree that its only certain parts of dragonknights that are overpowered, my brother plays a dragonknight and he says that his stamina dual wield build has no survivability.

Don't come here and tell me i'm playing wrong if I can't kill him... this build should destroy tanks, less armor, less healing and high burst ( bouts of 1000dps with ult up) and it felt like throwing a cotton ball at a brick wall.. yeah its really the build thats the problem.

Also define good player, because FOTM builds take out all the skill of building a character and blocking is as basic as it gets, so where is the skill? Running a build that he found on the internet because it operates overpowered mechanics?

protip: You can reduce his armor to 0% defense, but youll still get dmg reduction because he is blocking and thats a seperate table with its own mitigation bonuses. This is why light armor is superior to heavy right now.

glitchmaster999

Thechemicals wrote: »

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

Thechemicals wrote: »

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

I am a nightblade dps, my build has siphoning strikes and strife in it.

I met a dragonknight in bruma, I came out of sneak with my full dps kit and he healed it off, I sniped to reduce healing, he still healed it off. It was literally me beating on him watching him auto attack me and get his mana back while tanking the 720 dps I could dish out. When he got bored of tanking me, he ulted, shield bashed me and then burst me down in a matter of seconds.....

To all the people that say dragonknights are fine, they have been nerfed into the ground. I would agree except for the damage that they do while still being invincible is unbelievable. I was on a roll in bruma, I got my 19th player kill from 1v1 encounters and then this.

I'm not mad about it, it was kind of funny, he even sat on my smoldering corpse but there still seems to be a bit of a balance problem if he can literally stand there and never die.

So you went 19-1 and someone finally smashed your build into pieces and based on this personal experience, you feel that Dk's are imbalanced. Maybe take a look at what you were missing in that fight.By your description, you had zero defense/escapes/ohshit buttons if he dps'd you down in seconds. Also, you said you had strife, a low/moderate damage healing attack so im guessing this is what you spammed. That skill is not going to get you any real damage with siphonings penalty against a shield tank using dragonblood. You were basically playing his game and hoping your medium/light armor and heals would beat his Shield mitigation and healing. Of course you werent going to win. He was a good player and likely toy'd with you.What happened here is you didnt change your tactics. Gratz on 90%+ win ratio though, seems you did really well overrall, which makes this thread kinda a buzzkill.

Once again,this thread was not complaining dk's are broken, they are after all meant to be the best tanks, I think they are a bit more powerful than they should be particularly with the damage side of things but still.

His armor was reduced by 75% and he had reduced healing. My strife hits for 600, that's not moderate/low, that's the highest damage skill nightblades get. 700 dps without good sets or food is really damn good, I also have near unlimited resources with siphoning strikes, so he should of run out of stamina or magicka before I ran out of anything but despite people saying "dragonknights are only good while they have magicka" he also just casts one destro staff ability and then gets his mana back with unstable flames or some other fire move.

The highest sustained single target I have seen in this game is 900, I am getting 700, if that isn't enough to kill a tank that has reduced armor and reduced healing, that is the definition of unbalanced. I think dragonknights should be amazing tanks, but the fact they are getting unbelievable resource regeneration means that they can tank forever and then still dish out unbelievable damage. I agree that its only certain parts of dragonknights that are overpowered, my brother plays a dragonknight and he says that his stamina dual wield build has no survivability.

Don't come here and tell me i'm playing wrong if I can't kill him... this build should destroy tanks, less armor, less healing and high burst ( bouts of 1000dps with ult up) and it felt like throwing a cotton ball at a brick wall.. yeah its really the build thats the problem.

Also define good player, because FOTM builds take out all the skill of building a character and blocking is as basic as it gets, so where is the skill? Running a build that he found on the internet because it operates overpowered mechanics?

protip: You can reduce his armor to 0% defense, but youll still get dmg reduction because he is blocking and thats a seperate table with its own mitigation bonuses. This is why light armor is superior to heavy right now.

That's not why light armor is superior, heavy armor gives you overcharged armor, light armor gives you overcharged magic resist, you can get your armor to softcap with items or abilities and still get all the benefits of being light armor.

No *** blocking makes gives damage reduction, still shouldn't be able to do it forever.

SFBryan18

Seems there is a circular pattern. Magic kills tank with range. Tank kills assassin with endurance. And assassin kills range with stealth and power. So each off them are weak against the victim of their victim. Where does Templar fit in? They are a support class made for healing. If you don't have players to heal AKA a group, you shouldn't be playing a support role. The healer is not supposed to be effective in combat. They are supposed to leave the fighting to the group and they handle the healing. Like a medic on the battlefield. Seems people know so much about the stats in the game, but they refuse to see the strategy behind each character role. If you chose Templar and you are not following a group around, you chose to handicap yourself and that's your own fault.

Still_Mind

SFBryan18 wrote: »

Seems there is a circular pattern. Magic kills tank with range. Tank kills assassin with endurance. And assassin kills range with stealth and power. So each off them are weak against the victim of their victim. Where does Templar fit in? They are a support class made for healing. If you don't have players to heal AKA a group, you shouldn't be playing a support role. The healer is not supposed to be effective in combat. They are supposed to leave the fighting to the group and they handle the healing. Like a medic on the battlefield. Seems people know so much about the stats in the game, but they refuse to see the strategy behind each character role. If you chose Templar and you are not following a group around, you chose to handicap yourself and that's your own fault.

Paper is fine, nerf rock. Sincerely yours, Scissors.

Templars are mushrooms.

Thechemicals

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

Thechemicals wrote: »

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

Thechemicals wrote: »

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

I am a nightblade dps, my build has siphoning strikes and strife in it.

I met a dragonknight in bruma, I came out of sneak with my full dps kit and he healed it off, I sniped to reduce healing, he still healed it off. It was literally me beating on him watching him auto attack me and get his mana back while tanking the 720 dps I could dish out. When he got bored of tanking me, he ulted, shield bashed me and then burst me down in a matter of seconds.....

To all the people that say dragonknights are fine, they have been nerfed into the ground. I would agree except for the damage that they do while still being invincible is unbelievable. I was on a roll in bruma, I got my 19th player kill from 1v1 encounters and then this.

I'm not mad about it, it was kind of funny, he even sat on my smoldering corpse but there still seems to be a bit of a balance problem if he can literally stand there and never die.

So you went 19-1 and someone finally smashed your build into pieces and based on this personal experience, you feel that Dk's are imbalanced. Maybe take a look at what you were missing in that fight.By your description, you had zero defense/escapes/ohshit buttons if he dps'd you down in seconds. Also, you said you had strife, a low/moderate damage healing attack so im guessing this is what you spammed. That skill is not going to get you any real damage with siphonings penalty against a shield tank using dragonblood. You were basically playing his game and hoping your medium/light armor and heals would beat his Shield mitigation and healing. Of course you werent going to win. He was a good player and likely toy'd with you.What happened here is you didnt change your tactics. Gratz on 90%+ win ratio though, seems you did really well overrall, which makes this thread kinda a buzzkill.

Once again,this thread was not complaining dk's are broken, they are after all meant to be the best tanks, I think they are a bit more powerful than they should be particularly with the damage side of things but still.

His armor was reduced by 75% and he had reduced healing. My strife hits for 600, that's not moderate/low, that's the highest damage skill nightblades get. 700 dps without good sets or food is really damn good, I also have near unlimited resources with siphoning strikes, so he should of run out of stamina or magicka before I ran out of anything but despite people saying "dragonknights are only good while they have magicka" he also just casts one destro staff ability and then gets his mana back with unstable flames or some other fire move.

The highest sustained single target I have seen in this game is 900, I am getting 700, if that isn't enough to kill a tank that has reduced armor and reduced healing, that is the definition of unbalanced. I think dragonknights should be amazing tanks, but the fact they are getting unbelievable resource regeneration means that they can tank forever and then still dish out unbelievable damage. I agree that its only certain parts of dragonknights that are overpowered, my brother plays a dragonknight and he says that his stamina dual wield build has no survivability.

Don't come here and tell me i'm playing wrong if I can't kill him... this build should destroy tanks, less armor, less healing and high burst ( bouts of 1000dps with ult up) and it felt like throwing a cotton ball at a brick wall.. yeah its really the build thats the problem.

Also define good player, because FOTM builds take out all the skill of building a character and blocking is as basic as it gets, so where is the skill? Running a build that he found on the internet because it operates overpowered mechanics?

protip: You can reduce his armor to 0% defense, but youll still get dmg reduction because he is blocking and thats a seperate table with its own mitigation bonuses. This is why light armor is superior to heavy right now.

That's not why light armor is superior, heavy armor gives you overcharged armor, light armor gives you overcharged magic resist, you can get your armor to softcap with items or abilities and still get all the benefits of being light armor.

No *** blocking makes gives damage reduction, still shouldn't be able to do it forever.

you mean like the same way you can have magicka and stamina together with Siphoning ?

Still_Mind

<........> Accidental post

Paladin_echo1

Before you blame the DK, blame Bone shield. That move on a very tanky DK gives incredibly too much hp to the point defense just doesn't matter anymore. Also Spiked bone shield's reflect damage.

Axer

At least the fight ended.

I faced a tanky NB on my tank templar 1v1 the other day.

We both dealt so pathetic damage that the battle lasted well over 10min..

We eventually agreed to just call a truce and walk away.

Pretty sad state of affairs this game is in for NB/Templar dmg. It's so low we can't even pvp properly.

And it's not like I had the wrong skills or anything. I used the only bloody thing a templar has to do any real dmg - biting jabs. He simply went bow to keep his distance (magnum shot) then healed up with resto staff. I would swap to sword and board to charge/kb him, then he would fear me and heal up, rince and repeat, was nothing I could to end him, and nothing he could do to end me.

Pretty sure he was a experienced pvp'er to. VR12, good gear, Think he was around alliance rank 10. I have pretty much the best gear in the game for tanking.

DKs and Sorcerers can actaully deal enough damage to kill other players.. Even tank built players with strong healing. This is the huge inbalance in a game where every class can do everything.

Axer

Paladin_echo1 wrote: »

Before you blame the DK, blame Bone shield. That move on a very tanky DK gives incredibly too much hp to the point defense just doesn't matter anymore. Also Spiked bone shield's reflect damage.

lol.

Thats arguably the worst possible skill you can use in pvp.

Why:

99% of player deaths in cyrodil are caused by magicka attacks (well ignoring ones from siege weapons since we are talking 1v1 here). Armor has ZERO effect on magicka skills.

Bone shield only increases armor, for the player who cast it.

drackonir

If DK's block is a problem for you then L2P!, Really L2P and read what fr heavy attacks are! Stop banging his shield with that light attacks, and use HEAVY attacks instead, after 4 such hits DK is without Stamina.

IT is typical, instead learning game's mechanics, care-bears are running with nerfs cry to devs

glitchmaster999

drackonir wrote: »

If DK's block is a problem for you then L2P!, Really L2P and read what fr heavy attacks are! Stop banging his shield with that light attacks, and use HEAVY attacks instead, after 4 such hits DK is without Stamina.

IT is typical, instead learning game's mechanics, care-bears are running with nerfs cry to devs

I don't know a single build in the game that uses primarily heavy attacks and you tell me to L2P.... good luck with life, you are going to need it with a brain like yours

drackonir

glitchmaster999 wrote: »

drackonir wrote: »

If DK's block is a problem for you then L2P!, Really L2P and read what fr heavy attacks are! Stop banging his shield with that light attacks, and use HEAVY attacks instead, after 4 such hits DK is without Stamina.

IT is typical, instead learning game's mechanics, care-bears are running with nerfs cry to devs

I don't know a single build in the game that uses primarily heavy attacks and you tell me to L2P.... good luck with life, you are going to need it with a brain like yours

After reading your reply, I am happy to have one

Hilgara

The DK who have gotten used to just spamming a few abilities are now suffering. The ones that we're always skilled or have adopted to the changes are still doing well. The problem with easy mode classes is that when they are rebalanced and they have to be as skilled as all the rest of us to survive the ones that were good through skill and the ones that were good coz their class was OP are easily distinguished.