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So fix speed stacking but not shield stacking?
Strider_Roshin
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Yeah combing dodge rolling with the bow with activating double take was so game breaking that they made it so you couldn't attack them. But shield stacking is ok. Makes sense. -_-
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Ezareth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭When you can out run people on a max speed horse something is wrong. I know plenty of Bow gankers that ran this setup and if their gank failed they would just sprint off into the sunset and not even a sorc could catch them. Now with Sorc mobility gutted, it makes sense to reduce the maximum run speed of all classes. ( Which I'm assuming was designed to counter sorc mobility)
Permanently banned from the forums for displaying dissent: ESO - The Year Behind
Too Much Bolt Escape - banned for "hacking the game to create movement not otherwise permitted by in game mechanics."
Ezareth VR16 AD Sorc - Rank 36 - Axe NA
Ezareth-Ali VR16 DC NB - Rank 20 - Chillrend NA
Ezareth PvP on Youtube3 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭When you can out run people on a max speed horse something is wrong. I know plenty of Bow gankers that ran this setup and if their gank failed they would just sprint off into the sunset and not even a sorc could catch them. Now with Sorc mobility gutted, it makes sense to reduce the maximum run speed of all classes. ( Which I'm assuming was designed to counter sorc mobility)
Agreed! I know i saw a few that were able to run faster then the Flash from DC comics..i always laughed at how fast some of those Nightblades could run....it was pretty funny honestly. Your right though, it probably needed adjusted in some manner.Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak1 -
Strider_Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭When you can out run people on a max speed horse something is wrong. I know plenty of Bow gankers that ran this setup and if their gank failed they would just sprint off into the sunset and not even a sorc could catch them. Now with Sorc mobility gutted, it makes sense to reduce the maximum run speed of all classes. ( Which I'm assuming was designed to counter sorc mobility)
Yeah I call bs on the sorc comment. I use that combination and I still can't catch a bolt escaping sorc. By that logic a sorc shouldn't be able to outrun a maxed out horse either. Therefore they should nerf the distance of bolt escape if outrunning a horse is your concern.0 -
WolfgangArmadeus✭✭✭Everyone is able to stack shields if they want, no imbalance there... what is the issue? Does it take longer than 2 seconds to kill someone.? You shouldnt put an actual balancing/exploit issue into the mix when trying to get an intended and accessible strategy for all classes nerfed because it is harder for you to camo hunt your enemies/ and now when you fail you cant just run away...Edited by WolfgangArmadeus on 29 July 2015 14:311 -
Ezareth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Strider_Roshin wrote: »When you can out run people on a max speed horse something is wrong. I know plenty of Bow gankers that ran this setup and if their gank failed they would just sprint off into the sunset and not even a sorc could catch them. Now with Sorc mobility gutted, it makes sense to reduce the maximum run speed of all classes. ( Which I'm assuming was designed to counter sorc mobility)
Yeah I call bs on the sorc comment. I use that combination and I still can't catch a bolt escaping sorc. By that logic a sorc shouldn't be able to outrun a maxed out horse either. Therefore they should nerf the distance of bolt escape if outrunning a horse is your concern.
Then you're not using full medium armor or something because Double take was multiplicative with other speed bonuses from my understanding instead of just adding M.E.
A sorc can't bolt escape faster than a max speed horse today and he can't keep up with those NBs...I know because I've tried and it's pretty ridiculous.
On my NB I can keep pace with a bolt escaping sorc just using full medium and double take (no bow). I do it every day all day long, chase the bolting sorc until he runs OOM and then kill him.Permanently banned from the forums for displaying dissent: ESO - The Year Behind
Too Much Bolt Escape - banned for "hacking the game to create movement not otherwise permitted by in game mechanics."
Ezareth VR16 AD Sorc - Rank 36 - Axe NA
Ezareth-Ali VR16 DC NB - Rank 20 - Chillrend NA
Ezareth PvP on Youtube2 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Rename thread to hardened ward fix. That is the only shield that is over performing.V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)1 -
DisgracefulMind✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »Rename thread to hardened ward fix. That is the only shield that is over performing.
No, it's not over-performing.Unfortunate magicka warden main.
PC/NA Server
Fairweather Friends
Retired to baby bgs forever. Leave me alone.4 -
FENGRUSH✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭FENGRUSH moves very fast - this isnt something limited to NBs. Every class could move at whatever rate.
The reality is, bolt escaping in a single direction was still faster than running max speed. The difference is at some point you have to stop blinking, and then you can commence using gap closers.
But to say it was faster than blinking is actually untrue. This just further solidifies magicka sorc escape if you break free of gap closer range.
Not sure why they needed to do this to the bow passive. Its 2 seconds... dodge roll nerf is 4 seconds. This is just a bad move.1 -
Strider_Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭DisgracefulMind wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Rename thread to hardened ward fix. That is the only shield that is over performing.
No, it's not over-performing.
Yes it is, compare it to blazing shield; the only other powerful damage shield in the game. You'll see there's a huge discrepancy when comparing the cost and duration.0 -
Ezareth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭FENGRUSH moves very fast - this isnt something limited to NBs. Every class could move at whatever rate.
The reality is, bolt escaping in a single direction was still faster than running max speed. The difference is at some point you have to stop blinking, and then you can commence using gap closers.
But to say it was faster than blinking is actually untrue. This just further solidifies magicka sorc escape if you break free of gap closer range.
Not sure why they needed to do this to the bow passive. Its 2 seconds... dodge roll nerf is 4 seconds. This is just a bad move.
The Only way that bolt escaping is faster than running with doubletake - full medium armor is when you're using terrain to your advantage. Go out on the plain and I'll pace you with my NB using just double take as long as you can bolt. you might gain a few feet on me if I screw up my rotation or don't animation cancel sprint my double take properly since its much easier to spam a single key over and over but the difference is negligible. Add bow into that mix and a NB can pepper the sorc with arrows while chasing.Permanently banned from the forums for displaying dissent: ESO - The Year Behind
Too Much Bolt Escape - banned for "hacking the game to create movement not otherwise permitted by in game mechanics."
Ezareth VR16 AD Sorc - Rank 36 - Axe NA
Ezareth-Ali VR16 DC NB - Rank 20 - Chillrend NA
Ezareth PvP on Youtube1 -
Erock25✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Strider_Roshin wrote: »DisgracefulMind wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Rename thread to hardened ward fix. That is the only shield that is over performing.
No, it's not over-performing.
Yes it is, compare it to blazing shield; the only other powerful damage shield in the game. You'll see there's a huge discrepancy when comparing the cost and duration.
Besides the whole fact that Blazing SHield does AOE damage and templars have heals and better passive defenses, right?You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points0 -
hamon✭✭✭✭✭
✭Strider_Roshin wrote: »DisgracefulMind wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Rename thread to hardened ward fix. That is the only shield that is over performing.
No, it's not over-performing.
Yes it is, compare it to blazing shield; the only other powerful damage shield in the game. You'll see there's a huge discrepancy when comparing the cost and duration.
Besides the whole fact that Blazing SHield does AOE damage and templars have heals and better passive defenses, right?
why is it when ever anyone takes about the strengh of hardened ward sorcs want to comapre it to the entirer utility of a whole class?
surely that makes the point for them. if to counter argue against the strengh of ward , you have to include EVERYTHING other classes can do
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Erock25✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Strider_Roshin wrote: »DisgracefulMind wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Rename thread to hardened ward fix. That is the only shield that is over performing.
No, it's not over-performing.
Yes it is, compare it to blazing shield; the only other powerful damage shield in the game. You'll see there's a huge discrepancy when comparing the cost and duration.
Besides the whole fact that Blazing SHield does AOE damage and templars have heals and better passive defenses, right?
why is it when ever anyone takes about the strengh of hardened ward sorcs want to comapre it to the entirer utility of a whole class?
surely that makes the point for them. if to counter argue against the strengh of ward , you have to include EVERYTHING other classes can do
I disagree with you completely. Class defense is all that matters and class defense includes many different aspects. Sorcs have a nice damage shield and mobility while templars have a weaker damage shield (that has a secondary effect) while also having heals and better passive defenses. It isn't that hard to understand how we need to look at the whole instead of the parts.You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points1 -
DisgracefulMind✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Strider_Roshin wrote: »DisgracefulMind wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Rename thread to hardened ward fix. That is the only shield that is over performing.
No, it's not over-performing.
Yes it is, compare it to blazing shield; the only other powerful damage shield in the game. You'll see there's a huge discrepancy when comparing the cost and duration.
This is a tiresome argument with everyone who knows nothing about playing a Sorcerer. Give me a self heal, give me abilites that are not easily dodged or blocked. Then gg.
They nerfed streak, why take away our ONLY DEFENSE?Unfortunate magicka warden main.
PC/NA Server
Fairweather Friends
Retired to baby bgs forever. Leave me alone.1 -
Strider_Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭DisgracefulMind wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »DisgracefulMind wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Rename thread to hardened ward fix. That is the only shield that is over performing.
No, it's not over-performing.
Yes it is, compare it to blazing shield; the only other powerful damage shield in the game. You'll see there's a huge discrepancy when comparing the cost and duration.
This is a tiresome argument with everyone who knows nothing about playing a Sorcerer. Give me a self heal, give me abilites that are not easily dodged or blocked. Then gg.
They nerfed streak, why take away our ONLY DEFENSE?
I have a sorc alt. It's called healing ward. What? You mean you're using a 2H instead? Or how about the bow? SnS maybe? As a magicka sorc you use a staff, if you're stamina then welcome to the realm of stamina users. You'll have to wait for vigor.0 -
Greg✭✭✭there's a new set, called shield breaker that makes your light and heavy attacks do 949 irresistible damage against people with shields on, its has a 100% chance and no cool down
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eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
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Just because you weren't using that way doesn't mean others weren't or that it didn't need a fix.Strider_Roshin wrote: »When you can out run people on a max speed horse something is wrong. I know plenty of Bow gankers that ran this setup and if their gank failed they would just sprint off into the sunset and not even a sorc could catch them. Now with Sorc mobility gutted, it makes sense to reduce the maximum run speed of all classes. ( Which I'm assuming was designed to counter sorc mobility)
Yeah I call bs on the sorc comment. I use that combination and I still can't catch a bolt escaping sorc. By that logic a sorc shouldn't be able to outrun a maxed out horse either. Therefore they should nerf the distance of bolt escape if outrunning a horse is your concern.
:trollin:0 -
eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭FENGRUSH moves very fast - this isnt something limited to NBs. Every class could move at whatever rate.
The reality is, bolt escaping in a single direction was still faster than running max speed. The difference is at some point you have to stop blinking, and then you can commence using gap closers.
But to say it was faster than blinking is actually untrue. This just further solidifies magicka sorc escape if you break free of gap closer range.
Not sure why they needed to do this to the bow passive. Its 2 seconds... dodge roll nerf is 4 seconds. This is just a bad move.
The Only way that bolt escaping is faster than running with doubletake - full medium armor is when you're using terrain to your advantage. Go out on the plain and I'll pace you with my NB using just double take as long as you can bolt. you might gain a few feet on me if I screw up my rotation or don't animation cancel sprint my double take properly since its much easier to spam a single key over and over but the difference is negligible. Add bow into that mix and a NB can pepper the sorc with arrows while chasing.
And it's far more magicka efficient too.:trollin:0 -
DisgracefulMind✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Strider_Roshin wrote: »DisgracefulMind wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »DisgracefulMind wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Rename thread to hardened ward fix. That is the only shield that is over performing.
No, it's not over-performing.
Yes it is, compare it to blazing shield; the only other powerful damage shield in the game. You'll see there's a huge discrepancy when comparing the cost and duration.
This is a tiresome argument with everyone who knows nothing about playing a Sorcerer. Give me a self heal, give me abilites that are not easily dodged or blocked. Then gg.
They nerfed streak, why take away our ONLY DEFENSE?
I have a sorc alt. It's called healing ward. What? You mean you're using a 2H instead? Or how about the bow? SnS maybe? As a magicka sorc you use a staff, if you're stamina then welcome to the realm of stamina users. You'll have to wait for vigor.
You have no clue how I play. I don't use the cheese 2H or dual wield for spell damage. I'm a classic caster. Of course I use healing ward. Sadly, the benefit from healing ward is that if the shield IS NOT DAMAGED, you get a good heal, but it is ALSO on a timer. So it's NOT an instant heal. Nor can I put on DoT heals.
Since DKs have an amazing self heal, plus reflect, plus a shield, and Templars can self heal and have a shield (weak as it may be), and Nightblades can cloak off, why take away a Sorcs defense? Our ONLY defense, and the only way we can obtain heals if we put it our ward over the healing bubble. So, again, why should we get our only defense taken away?
EDIT: Healing Ward does instantly heal you for a very small percent, not enough to take note of, in my opinion.Edited by DisgracefulMind on 29 July 2015 16:02Unfortunate magicka warden main.
PC/NA Server
Fairweather Friends
Retired to baby bgs forever. Leave me alone.0 -
FENGRUSH✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭FENGRUSH moves very fast - this isnt something limited to NBs. Every class could move at whatever rate.
The reality is, bolt escaping in a single direction was still faster than running max speed. The difference is at some point you have to stop blinking, and then you can commence using gap closers.
But to say it was faster than blinking is actually untrue. This just further solidifies magicka sorc escape if you break free of gap closer range.
Not sure why they needed to do this to the bow passive. Its 2 seconds... dodge roll nerf is 4 seconds. This is just a bad move.
The Only way that bolt escaping is faster than running with doubletake - full medium armor is when you're using terrain to your advantage. Go out on the plain and I'll pace you with my NB using just double take as long as you can bolt. you might gain a few feet on me if I screw up my rotation or don't animation cancel sprint my double take properly since its much easier to spam a single key over and over but the difference is negligible. Add bow into that mix and a NB can pepper the sorc with arrows while chasing.
Yes - the difference is negligible. I just dont see it as a bad thing. If you want to create seperation from others, you can do that. Both with blink and the speed. NBs are a whole different issue because they have the best of a lot of things right now, active and passive!
But bow users having a speed option open to everyone that has costs assigned to it, dodge rolls - which wont be spammable.... what is the issue changing this and negating that entirely?
You dont see players in large groups running around with bows. It had a place in cyrodiil, and now its been taken away. Dont agree with this at all.0 -
Ezareth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭FENGRUSH moves very fast - this isnt something limited to NBs. Every class could move at whatever rate.
The reality is, bolt escaping in a single direction was still faster than running max speed. The difference is at some point you have to stop blinking, and then you can commence using gap closers.
But to say it was faster than blinking is actually untrue. This just further solidifies magicka sorc escape if you break free of gap closer range.
Not sure why they needed to do this to the bow passive. Its 2 seconds... dodge roll nerf is 4 seconds. This is just a bad move.
The Only way that bolt escaping is faster than running with doubletake - full medium armor is when you're using terrain to your advantage. Go out on the plain and I'll pace you with my NB using just double take as long as you can bolt. you might gain a few feet on me if I screw up my rotation or don't animation cancel sprint my double take properly since its much easier to spam a single key over and over but the difference is negligible. Add bow into that mix and a NB can pepper the sorc with arrows while chasing.
Yes - the difference is negligible. I just dont see it as a bad thing. If you want to create seperation from others, you can do that. Both with blink and the speed. NBs are a whole different issue because they have the best of a lot of things right now, active and passive!
But bow users having a speed option open to everyone that has costs assigned to it, dodge rolls - which wont be spammable.... what is the issue changing this and negating that entirely?
You dont see players in large groups running around with bows. It had a place in cyrodiil, and now its been taken away. Dont agree with this at all.
Look at it this way. With the new emphasis being placed on Tel Var stones, having a guaranteed escape (and the longest range abilities in the game) is just too powerful. You can basically escape any fight because no one can keep up with you. If speed isn't toned down a bit then that is exactly what you'd have.
I think now it's much more balanced and there are still benefits to moving max speed....it's just not as fast as it used to be.
The bow however needs a better passive now as the movement speed bonus after dodge rolling isn't all that good considering so many other players are using alternative movement speed bonuses.
Permanently banned from the forums for displaying dissent: ESO - The Year Behind
Too Much Bolt Escape - banned for "hacking the game to create movement not otherwise permitted by in game mechanics."
Ezareth VR16 AD Sorc - Rank 36 - Axe NA
Ezareth-Ali VR16 DC NB - Rank 20 - Chillrend NA
Ezareth PvP on Youtube0 -
Leandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This is one of my gripes as well. Especially since they did not nerf the magicka NB speed, which comes from slotting concealed and is almost as fast as bow passive.
At least they freed up two skill points since hasty retreat is now useless for nightblades.0 -
Ezareth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭This is one of my gripes as well. Especially since they did not nerf the magicka NB speed, which comes from slotting concealed and is almost as fast as bow passive.
At least they freed up two skill points since hasty retreat is now useless for nightblades.
Actually Magicka NB speed was nerfed as well.
Double-take was a multiplicative effect instead of a flat 30% modifier so magicka nightblades with concealed weapon and double-take are going to be slower as well.
The fastest players in the game will still be sprinting full medium armor players with M.E. up.Permanently banned from the forums for displaying dissent: ESO - The Year Behind
Too Much Bolt Escape - banned for "hacking the game to create movement not otherwise permitted by in game mechanics."
Ezareth VR16 AD Sorc - Rank 36 - Axe NA
Ezareth-Ali VR16 DC NB - Rank 20 - Chillrend NA
Ezareth PvP on Youtube0 -
Teiji✭✭✭✭✭Make all damage shields scale with max magicka and it's gg.
Sorc has a million and one utility tools, Sorc is for the player who grew up on Shogun Total War, C&C, Age of Empires - it is the tactician class and Sorc is one of my most enjoyed classes in this game.
Encase, instant-cast Rune Prison, Bolt Escape, Ward->healing ward->refresh original ward to guarantee heal from healing ward, plus block piercing, dodge roll ignoring Curse.
Sorc is the class which rewards you by being able to bully small groups and solo players providing you make zero to minimal mistakes. Magic is supposed to be a complex school, just how martial arts require immense skill and physical strength.
In short, as a Sorc enthusiast, Ward is not the only defensive ability available to us, all damage shields should scale with max magicka - once this happens, we'll be able to get a much better idea of how to balance all of them. Igneous Shield scales with max health, wtf? Almost as bad as having health regen as a stat you can itemise, health regen in all videogames is a joke and the weakest stat imaginable."Serving Boethiah is Freedom, embracing heroism is Liberty, existing solely for noxiphilic sanguivoria is truth." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
European megaserver Fallout 4
Loyalist of Boethiah, heroism enthusiast, exposer of secrets, bless'ed of noxiphilic sanguivoria.
Nerf one grind, two more take its place; hail Gryndra!
I am a dank memer and satire enthusiast1 -
Forestd16b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Again shield stacking is a broken mechanic and needs to be changed to max of 2 shields or no stacking at all. Been saying it since day 1.0 -
Leandor✭✭✭✭✭
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Double take already does provide major expedition buff on live. it does not stack with maneuver. The bow passive was what made the stam blade so fast.This is one of my gripes as well. Especially since they did not nerf the magicka NB speed, which comes from slotting concealed and is almost as fast as bow passive.
At least they freed up two skill points since hasty retreat is now useless for nightblades.
Actually Magicka NB speed was nerfed as well.
Double-take was a multiplicative effect instead of a flat 30% modifier so magicka nightblades with concealed weapon and double-take are going to be slower as well.
The fastest players in the game will still be sprinting full medium armor players with M.E. up.
Concealed did and will give a separate speed increase. It did and will work together with major expedition.
I must admit that I do not know whether any of these is additive or multiplicative.Edited by Leandor on 29 July 2015 17:030 -
Teargrants✭✭✭✭✭
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Mhm mhm I totally agree 100%, remove all shield stacking yeah. I hate it when pesky magicka builds stack harness magicka and healing ward to make it take actual effort for me to kill them. Removing shield stacking would be the biggest buff to my sorc in a long while, maybe ever since I myself don't shield stack.Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Again shield stacking is a broken mechanic and needs to be changed to max of 2 shields or no stacking at all. Been saying it since day 1.
Please forum whiners, continue making nerf threads, maybe ZOS will actually listen and buff me.POST EQVITEM SEDET ATRA CVRA
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Ezareth✭✭✭✭✭
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Double take already does provide major expedition buff on live. it does not stack with maneuver. The bow passive was what made the stam blade so fast.This is one of my gripes as well. Especially since they did not nerf the magicka NB speed, which comes from slotting concealed and is almost as fast as bow passive.
At least they freed up two skill points since hasty retreat is now useless for nightblades.
Actually Magicka NB speed was nerfed as well.
Double-take was a multiplicative effect instead of a flat 30% modifier so magicka nightblades with concealed weapon and double-take are going to be slower as well.
The fastest players in the game will still be sprinting full medium armor players with M.E. up.
Concealed did and will give a separate speed increase. It did and will work together with major expedition.
I must admit that I do not know whether any of these is additive or multiplicative.
Double-take actually was added into the does not stack with M.E code but the speed buff it provided behaved differently.
My Nightblade runs noticeably faster with doubletake than he does with Retreating manuevers. Test them out yourself and see.Permanently banned from the forums for displaying dissent: ESO - The Year Behind
Too Much Bolt Escape - banned for "hacking the game to create movement not otherwise permitted by in game mechanics."
Ezareth VR16 AD Sorc - Rank 36 - Axe NA
Ezareth-Ali VR16 DC NB - Rank 20 - Chillrend NA
Ezareth PvP on Youtube0 -
TheBucket✭✭✭✭When you can out run people on a max speed horse something is wrong. I know plenty of Bow gankers that ran this setup and if their gank failed they would just sprint off into the sunset and not even a sorc could catch them. Now with Sorc mobility gutted, it makes sense to reduce the maximum run speed of all classes. ( Which I'm assuming was designed to counter sorc mobility)
That's not even what made some of the builds fast. VR14's would use the level 15 armor that increased speed and the steed mundus stone with mundus buffs. There is one specific NB that does it and he's so fast if you blink, you'll miss him.William Reignes
Magic Nightblade - Rogue Bomber
Creator of Thirsty Thief Build (Retired 1.5)0
