I'm wondering the same thing. Making an Argonian Nightblade tank based on the assumption that those stack along with the potion bonuses.

ThatHappyCat wrote: »

It works with all healing you receive. It's only 6% however, I really wouldn't call it a synergy; just a minor bonus.

It's everything together...
Argonians get +15% potion effectiveness, add to that the +10% from Siphoning.
6% from Argonian + 15% Siphoning = 21% healing
Edit : add 7% more to all healing from Swallow Soul in siphoning line, so 28% healing.
Now the question here is... does the bonus to healing count for Healing potions too?
If so... 41% (Edit : 48% with Swallow soul)better healing potions, sounds pretty snazzy to me.

Then you have stuff like Drain Essence + 6%.

That's a lot of bonusses, the supposed dinky Argonians get.

The reason I asked this is that I am making a Warlock type character, Argonian that from afar throws dotts on enemies, CC's and while doing so heals himself.

Counting all of this, I can see a lot of potential due to the fact the Argonian seems to have an amazing staying power.

Slyfe wrote: »

Yeah that's what I was seeing as well, but with the way everyone is saying Argo's had horrible racials I figured I was missing something or they don't stack.

Or it could be multiplicative instead of additive.

Excuse my math as I'm not as *1337MATHNERD* as I wish I was but...

Additive would be:
6% from Quick to Mend + 15% Soul Siphoner + 10% Swallow Soul= 31% healing
(I think max Swallow Soul is 10%)

Multiplicative would be:
1-(1-.06)(1-.15)(1-.10) = N
1-(.94)(.85)(.90) = N
1-.7191 = N
.2809 = N (or 28.09%)

If my math is wrong feel free to correct me though.

Also if we have any code delvers out there, they may know without a doubt which abilities stack or not and which ones are additive vs multiplicative. I've played games where not every ability stacked the same way. Made for some interesting theorycrafting.

Brasseurfb16_ESO wrote: »

Slyfe wrote: »

Yeah that's what I was seeing as well, but with the way everyone is saying Argo's had horrible racials I figured I was missing something or they don't stack.

They say Argonians have horrible racials because they don't get the same stat benefits as the other races but, ignorant as they are, forget it is so easy to hit soft cap with those stats that you don't get as much benefits as you think it would.

While Argonians on the other hand, they might only have 3% hp bonus but they do instead get 15% potion effects, a lot of Disease and Poison dmg resistance (common dmg type), and the extra self Healing. Most of those perks are not affected by diminushing returns and/or leave open slots in your utility (jewelry) slots for enchantments.

Psionyxz wrote: »

Or it could be multiplicative instead of additive.

Excuse my math as I'm not as *1337MATHNERD* as I wish I was but...

Additive would be:
6% from Quick to Mend + 15% Soul Siphoner + 10% Swallow Soul= 31% healing
(I think max Swallow Soul is 10%)

Multiplicative would be:
1-(1-.06)(1-.15)(1-.10) = N
1-(.94)(.85)(.90) = N
1-.7191 = N
.2809 = N (or 28.09%)

If my math is wrong feel free to correct me though.

Also if we have any code delvers out there, they may know without a doubt which abilities stack or not and which ones are additive vs multiplicative. I've played games where not every ability stacked the same way. Made for some interesting theorycrafting.

Healing bonuses from Quick to Mend (Heavy armour and Argionians) and Swallow Souls are additive. But when it comes to Soul Siphoner passive, it increases the healing done by siphoning attacks by 15% and does not stack additively with Healing bonuses from Quick to Mend and Swallow Souls, instead, it works multiplicatively with those bonuses.

Let me explain you in an exemple :

You are an Argonian with Swallow Souls r4, Heavy Armour passives + Argonian passives : 10% + 7% + 6% = 23%

a) If your base Strife r4 hits your target for 400dmg you will heal yourself for : 400 x 1/4 = 100 health every 2sec for 10sec.

b) with Soul Siphoner passive those results become : (400 x 1/4) x 1.15 = 115 health every 2sec for 10sec

c) with Soul Siphoner, Swallow Souls, Quick to Mend passives (Heavy Armour + Argonian) you get the following results : [(400 x 1/4) x 1.15] x 1.23 = 141.45

So with your racials, heavy armour, swallow souls and siphoning passives you can increase the base healing value of your strife by 41,5% on yourself.

So Argonian would make a great race for NB Warlock type caster?

Jeddahwe wrote: »

Brasseurfb16_ESO wrote: »

Slyfe wrote: »

Yeah that's what I was seeing as well, but with the way everyone is saying Argo's had horrible racials I figured I was missing something or they don't stack.

They say Argonians have horrible racials because they don't get the same stat benefits as the other races but, ignorant as they are, forget it is so easy to hit soft cap with those stats that you don't get as much benefits as you think it would.

While Argonians on the other hand, they might only have 3% hp bonus but they do instead get 15% potion effects, a lot of Disease and Poison dmg resistance (common dmg type), and the extra self Healing. Most of those perks are not affected by diminushing returns and/or leave open slots in your utility (jewelry) slots for enchantments.

Psionyxz wrote: »

Or it could be multiplicative instead of additive.

Excuse my math as I'm not as *1337MATHNERD* as I wish I was but...

Additive would be:
6% from Quick to Mend + 15% Soul Siphoner + 10% Swallow Soul= 31% healing
(I think max Swallow Soul is 10%)

Multiplicative would be:
1-(1-.06)(1-.15)(1-.10) = N
1-(.94)(.85)(.90) = N
1-.7191 = N
.2809 = N (or 28.09%)

If my math is wrong feel free to correct me though.

Also if we have any code delvers out there, they may know without a doubt which abilities stack or not and which ones are additive vs multiplicative. I've played games where not every ability stacked the same way. Made for some interesting theorycrafting.

Healing bonuses from Quick to Mend (Heavy armour and Argionians) and Swallow Souls are additive. But when it comes to Soul Siphoner passive, it increases the healing done by siphoning attacks by 15% and does not stack additively with Healing bonuses from Quick to Mend and Swallow Souls, instead, it works multiplicatively with those bonuses.

Let me explain you in an exemple :

You are an Argonian with Swallow Souls r4, Heavy Armour passives + Argonian passives : 10% + 7% + 6% = 23%

a) If your base Strife r4 hits your target for 400dmg you will heal yourself for : 400 x 1/4 = 100 health every 2sec for 10sec.

b) with Soul Siphoner passive those results become : (400 x 1/4) x 1.15 = 115 health every 2sec for 10sec

c) with Soul Siphoner, Swallow Souls, Quick to Mend passives (Heavy Armour + Argonian) you get the following results : [(400 x 1/4) x 1.15] x 1.23 = 141.45

So with your racials, heavy armour, swallow souls and siphoning passives you can increase the base healing value of your strife by 41,5% on yourself.

So Argonian would make a great race for NB Warlock type caster?

Indeed, they can make fantastic Bloodmages, Warlock and Darknight types of characters. Best is questionable, but they would certainly get the most out of potions and healing effects from siphoning abilities and allies.

This thread has stoked the wonder of healing an Argonian Heavy Armor Nightblade Tank with Swallow Souls slotted and some +Healing Taken gear, possibly being healed by a healer with +healing gear.

Slyfe wrote: »

I'm wondering the same thing. Making an Argonian Nightblade tank based on the assumption that those stack along with the potion bonuses.

Celless wrote: »

This thread has stoked the wonder of healing an Argonian Heavy Armor Nightblade Tank with Swallow Souls slotted and some +Healing Taken gear, possibly being healed by a healer with +healing gear.

This is the exact build I've been using since launch. I LOVE it, especially at end-game. My main is an Argonian NB Alchemist (and Provisioner). I currently use 5 heavy and 2 light armor pieces, with these sets: 5-piece Footman, 4-piece Unassailable, 3-piece Shalidor's Curse.

This enables high mitigation and health (I sit just over 3.4k with food buffs) and rounded magicka/stamina, as well as +29% Healing received (could be 31% if I used 7/7 Heavy Armor, which I will probably do after 1.6), and 45% more effective potions with them lasting 30% longer. With certain ability choices, I can put my max health even higher and have 39% healing received (again, could be 41% if you went full Heavy). Being a healing sponge like this makes things much easier for your group's healer, who can more freely use other support abilities and add DPS. While the NB class lacks an instant heal and relies on HoTs, this build makes it so your potions become large, instant heals that require no resources (using two potion speed glyphs and one heal potion effectiveness glyph). In addition, block-casting sap essence in packs of mobs provides enough group healing so that that healer doesn't have to heal much at all, frequently procs Siphoning Attacks for great sustain, and generates a ton of ultimate (though that of course is changing with 1.6)

I get so much satisfaction out of surprising reluctant group members because of how effective this build is.

HOWEVER, 1.6 is changing a lot of things. (1) All potion effectiveness passives have been removed from the game, so NBs and Argonians got severely shafted because the new passives are not nearly as good. (2) Buff effects from potions and abilities now compete with another instead of stacking, severely limiting the usefulness of potions other than restore hp/mag/stam. (3) Swallow Soul now only grants +8% healing received while slotted, compared to the previous 10%. But, the changes to Mirage, Reaper's Mark, and Refreshing Path make them awesome for tanking now. There is also a Champion passive that increases healing received.