pvp players changing characters for ganking

S10Reaper

Here lately I've been experiencing a lot of unnecessary jumping and ganking while either in the IC sewers or questing dailies in Cyrodiil. With players camping quest givers and door locations that requires a character to be loaded into. Also having spies on different alliances such as a players giving other alliances locations on where everyone is one problem, I have a bigger problem. Past couple weeks I have ran across other players that will be in the same alliance at that moment, then few minutes later see that same player be on the opposing faction. From what I understand if a player has 2 characters on the same account that are different factions, either character cannot be on the same pvp server. From what I've been seeing, especially in the sewers, players will farm certain areas with their EP character. Then if other players start showing up inturrupting their progress or farming, that players will switch from their EP character to their DC or AD faction character and kill whoever is in "their" farm spot. I find this very annoying to that not only am I having fight players from other factions, I'm having to fight players that are on my same alliance. What I would like to know is this, is there anything that Zeinamax can/is/ or going to do about this problem or is this suppose to be part of the system that any and everyone can exploit?

scubanj1ub17_ESO

Completely agree S10! That practice is flat out cheating. The childish idiots doing this need to be banned from the game. A lot of us are in our own areas farming XP, using experience scrolls and minding our own business. Cheating like this is ruining both the fun and the game. I doubt it was in the spirit of what ZOS wanted when they designed these areas, although with some of the terrible design decisions they have made that enable this sort of idiocy maybe they did. Either way, ZOS should step up and do the right thing here.

myrrrorb14_ESO

Sounds like they are playing within the framework of the game. So I don't think anything can be done.

lolo_01b16_ESO

First of all, the risk of being ganked is the price you pay for getting much higher quest rewards than you would get for a quest that requires the same effort in a pve zone. And if you buff your defenses (shield, armour buff, cc immunity) before talking to a quest giver most gankers will fail, as they usually are bad pvpers.

Yes spies can be a problem, not only when you are grinding, but also when you're fighting over keeps. But it's not cheating, it's part of a design decision zos made. You can always join the same campaign as your group members, so if you are grinding with a friend, he can set the campaign as home on his dc char, you set it as home on your ep char and then you can both enter the campaign on both chars when you group up.
Zos could change this by removing the "travel with group" option, but I doubt they will do it.

S10Reaper

If it's within the framework of the game, then it is completely broken. It's bad enough that I have to worry about being jumped from any spot at any location in cyrodiil or how glitchy pvp really is from animation glitching to alliance spying. Major thing I have to worry about now is studying names of players in my own faction to estimate when they are going to turn on me. So far I have a few psn names written down of players that do this. If me or my guild is in a location that they want us to be in, they swap to their other faction character to take us out. It's ridiculous, I see why major pvp guilds and now some guild traders are requiring screen shots of a players character selection sheet. Hopefully something can be resolved about this issue, I'm pretty sure I'm not the player that has experienced this situation.

KeplerMG

It would be a much better game if people couldn't cross-realm. Cross-realming, along with bad combat system decisions (circumstantial or not) are what make ESO the breeding/festering ground for trolls/cheaters/expoilters that it is.

**You don't even have to co-op. Just re-roll the class that has the most animation-cancel-macro-friendly abilities (cough-NB-cough) Or the class that allows you to have the highest DPS and defense all in one attribute (cough-SORC-Cough) and have at it. Go around Cyrodiil making people want to uninstall. That's what everyone else is doing. And so far Zenipoo is okey dokey with it.**

(**Denotes a satirical statement and is not actual advice)

FriedEggSandwich

Become a counter spy and spread false info

americansteel

Xbox. kill all elves?

Islyn

scubanj1ub17_ESO wrote: »

Completely agree S10! That practice is flat out cheating. The childish idiots doing this need to be banned from the game. A lot of us are in our own areas farming XP, using experience scrolls and minding our own business. Cheating like this is ruining both the fun and the game. I doubt it was in the spirit of what ZOS wanted when they designed these areas, although with some of the terrible design decisions they have made that enable this sort of idiocy maybe they did. Either way, ZOS should step up and do the right thing here.

I've said this before too, but I think that one should not be allowed to have characters of different alliances homed/guest on the same campaign. This can be circumvented by owning multiple accounts, but to prevent it at least a bit, they could disallow characters from different alliances within one account to home/guest on the same campaign.

socivL

KeplerMG wrote: »

It would be a much better game if people couldn't cross-realm. Cross-realming, along with bad combat system decisions (circumstantial or not) are what make ESO the breeding/festering ground for trolls/cheaters/expoilters that it is.

girls Like bad-boys

S10Reaper

Islyn wrote: »

scubanj1ub17_ESO wrote: »

Completely agree S10! That practice is flat out cheating. The childish idiots doing this need to be banned from the game. A lot of us are in our own areas farming XP, using experience scrolls and minding our own business. Cheating like this is ruining both the fun and the game. I doubt it was in the spirit of what ZOS wanted when they designed these areas, although with some of the terrible design decisions they have made that enable this sort of idiocy maybe they did. Either way, ZOS should step up and do the right thing here.

I've said this before too, but I think that one should not be allowed to have characters of different alliances homed/guest on the same campaign. This can be circumvented by owning multiple accounts, but to prevent it at least a bit, they could disallow characters from different alliances within one account to home/guest on the same campaign.

Technically, that is how it's suppose to be, stated by Zenimax in an email that scubanj1ub17_ESO recieved. But like lolo_01b16_ESO said, if one buddy has a EP character with a certain campaign set as home and another buddy that has a DC character with the same pvp server set as home, it's easy to help each get their alt characters in that same server just by group queuing. That's the break in the system that is currently getting worse. I'm seeing more and more players exploit this to their complete advantage.

KeplerMG

socivL wrote: »

KeplerMG wrote: »

It would be a much better game if people couldn't cross-realm. Cross-realming, along with bad combat system decisions (circumstantial or not) are what make ESO the breeding/festering ground for trolls/cheaters/expoilters that it is.

girls Like bad-boys

So do lonely prison inmates.

Turelus

Maybe kill them instead of dying to them and losing your grind spot.

I mean, if they're logging of the character which are taking your exp and are unkillable, to log in one which are killable... kill them.

Otherwise this isn't against any rules in the game and will be more accessible (without campaign entry work around) once ZOS remove the lock on assigning oppose faction characters to the same campaign.

scubanj1ub17_ESO

There are two unassailable facts here.

1) Ganking hurts the game. Takes the fun out of it. Us players who don't PvP come here to get our xp by doing the dailies. If players want to PvP go fight at the keeps. Sneaking around and attacking other players while they're talking to an NPC or fighting mobs already is not PvP. It's immature. It does not take skill. It is tantamount to hitting a man with his back turned. Those that are defending the practice, I'm sure you're the ones doing it and feel the need to defend it because you know how wrong it is. If you're life is so empty you have to ruin other people's time in the game maybe you need to get a better life? Just wait until you graduate middle school. It gets better.

2) logging in to find players to gank, then telling your friends in another faction and logging over to then help kill them is not how this game was designed. Nor is taking your own factions scroll and running it to an enemy keep bc you can't get killed. ZOS is saying it's player politics is a lazy answer, and frankly one they should embarrassed about. Again, it takes no skill to rat out other players positions or take a scroll to an enemy keep. That is absolutely, 100% cheating. And the fact ZOS won't address it is an admital of, at best, their own laziness, and at worse, their lack of being able too. Either way, shame on ZOS and shame on the players engaging in this practice.

If ZOS won't or can't do anything about it then we should. Let's start a thread and publicly shake the cheaters and gankers. Maybe then these children will learn it's not nice to ruin others people's time in the game because they feel bad about themselves.

RAGUNAnoOne

Why is this in the guild recruitment forums?

thelordoffelines

scubanj1ub17_ESO wrote: »

There are two unassailable facts here.

1) Ganking hurts the game. Takes the fun out of it. Us players who don't PvP come here to get our xp by doing the dailies. If players want to PvP go fight at the keeps. Sneaking around and attacking other players while they're talking to an NPC or fighting mobs already is not PvP. It's immature. It does not take skill. It is tantamount to hitting a man with his back turned. Those that are defending the practice, I'm sure you're the ones doing it and feel the need to defend it because you know how wrong it is. If you're life is so empty you have to ruin other people's time in the game maybe you need to get a better life? Just wait until you graduate middle school. It gets better.

2) logging in to find players to gank, then telling your friends in another faction and logging over to then help kill them is not how this game was designed. Nor is taking your own factions scroll and running it to an enemy keep bc you can't get killed. ZOS is saying it's player politics is a lazy answer, and frankly one they should embarrassed about. Again, it takes no skill to rat out other players positions or take a scroll to an enemy keep. That is absolutely, 100% cheating. And the fact ZOS won't address it is an admital of, at best, their own laziness, and at worse, their lack of being able too. Either way, shame on ZOS and shame on the players engaging in this practice.

If ZOS won't or can't do anything about it then we should. Let's start a thread and publicly shake the cheaters and gankers. Maybe then these children will learn it's not nice to ruin others people's time in the game because they feel bad about themselves.

im curious how ganking is immature. Everyone whos not a ganker will agree its a very frustrating event to be ganked but just because its not your style of play that makes it immature?

DaveMoeDee

myrrrorb14_ESO wrote: »

Sounds like they are playing within the framework of the game. So I don't think anything can be done.

And all exploits are also within the framework of the game. Not a real response.

The spy thing is a major problem because you can't kill them. That makes the game a bit broken and quite stupid. Saying the game allows it is a pointless answer. People get kicked out of the game for exploits so behavior is not expected to only be limited by what is possible.

If ZOS wants the game to have long term staying power, they might want to police behavior that leads people to just give up on the game because it ceases to be fun. You can't expect players to police themselves because a lot of players, like a lot of people in the world, are a-holes.

On the other hand, there is nothing wrong with ganking at all. Hiding at quest hubs and attacking people doing quests is good for the game. As someone who has been ganked a lot and who doesn't have the dps to do any ganking, I appreciate the danger aspect of questing in Cyrodiil. It is a PvP zone. Quests were not put there to let people PvE unaccosted. They were put there to have another place where confrontations could happen. If you don't want that, stay out of Cyrodiil. Pretty simple solution.

The ganking at quest hubs is also a good thing for the faction of the person being ganked because it discourages people from taking server spots to just PvE and bail. After lag, the next worst thing for PvP is a pop-locked faction where people are all in IC or doing PvE quests.

For those who talk about "immature", how is killing enemy combatants in a PvP zone any worse than complaining about having to fight opposing army members in PvP war zones? They are playing a game the way it was designed to be played. That is not immature.

DaveMoeDee

S10Reaper wrote: »

Islyn wrote: »

scubanj1ub17_ESO wrote: »

Completely agree S10! That practice is flat out cheating. The childish idiots doing this need to be banned from the game. A lot of us are in our own areas farming XP, using experience scrolls and minding our own business. Cheating like this is ruining both the fun and the game. I doubt it was in the spirit of what ZOS wanted when they designed these areas, although with some of the terrible design decisions they have made that enable this sort of idiocy maybe they did. Either way, ZOS should step up and do the right thing here.

I've said this before too, but I think that one should not be allowed to have characters of different alliances homed/guest on the same campaign. This can be circumvented by owning multiple accounts, but to prevent it at least a bit, they could disallow characters from different alliances within one account to home/guest on the same campaign.

Technically, that is how it's suppose to be, stated by Zenimax in an email that scubanj1ub17_ESO recieved. But like lolo_01b16_ESO said, if one buddy has a EP character with a certain campaign set as home and another buddy that has a DC character with the same pvp server set as home, it's easy to help each get their alt characters in that same server just by group queuing. That's the break in the system that is currently getting worse. I'm seeing more and more players exploit this to their complete advantage.

I don't think playing both sides is a problem in itself. The problem is when someone you can't kill grabs your scroll to bring it to the enemy.

DaveMoeDee

scubanj1ub17_ESO wrote: »

There are two unassailable facts here.

1) Ganking hurts the game. Takes the fun out of it. Us players who don't PvP come here to get our xp by doing the dailies. If players want to PvP go fight at the keeps. Sneaking around and attacking other players while they're talking to an NPC or fighting mobs already is not PvP. It's immature. It does not take skill. It is tantamount to hitting a man with his back turned. Those that are defending the practice, I'm sure you're the ones doing it and feel the need to defend it because you know how wrong it is. If you're life is so empty you have to ruin other people's time in the game maybe you need to get a better life? Just wait until you graduate middle school. It gets better.

I defend ganking all the time but I don't do it. I would probably get killed. My DPS is crap.

Skill is irrelevant. PvP is ESO is a war, not a tournament.

Your comments are poor logic. If someone defends something, you claim it is because they know it is wrong? And if they don't defend it, I suppose you would say that they admit it is wrong in their silence? Instead of actually having a discussion, you are publicly stating that you will not listen to any arguments that oppose the opinion you already have.

Get your XP elsewhere. You are the problem. If someone attacks you, it is PvP by definition. You are an enemy combatant. You are in a war zone. The game isn't designed to pander to you and give you everything you want the way you want it. Calling others immature won't make that so. It is also a clear case the pot calling the kettle black. Complaining about dying in a PvP war zone is about as immature a it gets. Adults should understand that you don't always get what you want handed to you.

Maim

Mr. Wheeler does not understand PvP. There are so many inherent FLAWS with the system that is in place it's not even funny....nor is it enjoyable to play. It goes beyond mere 'spies' as anyone can have a second account, but assume most people will not. Perhaps a simple diagram on a white board dry erase will explain it.....ask me. I will show you.

jrkhan

If a sheep walks in to a den of wolves, would you consider it immature for the wolves to eat it?

MormondPayne_EP

Firstly, how is this cheating?

Secondly, you seem hurt, can I call you a Waaaaaaah-mbulance?

S10Reaper

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

scubanj1ub17_ESO wrote: »

There are two unassailable facts here.

1) Ganking hurts the game. Takes the fun out of it. Us players who don't PvP come here to get our xp by doing the dailies. If players want to PvP go fight at the keeps. Sneaking around and attacking other players while they're talking to an NPC or fighting mobs already is not PvP. It's immature. It does not take skill. It is tantamount to hitting a man with his back turned. Those that are defending the practice, I'm sure you're the ones doing it and feel the need to defend it because you know how wrong it is. If you're life is so empty you have to ruin other people's time in the game maybe you need to get a better life? Just wait until you graduate middle school. It gets better.

I defend ganking all the time but I don't do it. I would probably get killed. My DPS is crap.

Skill is irrelevant. PvP is ESO is a war, not a tournament.

Your comments are poor logic. If someone defends something, you claim it is because they know it is wrong? And if they don't defend it, I suppose you would say that they admit it is wrong in their silence? Instead of actually having a discussion, you are publicly stating that you will not listen to any arguments that oppose the opinion you already have.

Get your XP elsewhere. You are the problem. If someone attacks you, it is PvP by definition. You are an enemy combatant. You are in a war zone. The game isn't designed to pander to you and give you everything you want the way you want it. Calling others immature won't make that so. It is also a clear case the pot calling the kettle black. Complaining about dying in a PvP war zone is about as immature a it gets. Adults should understand that you don't always get what you want handed to you.

Tell me the logic in a faction that ganks it's own faction. ESO faction pvp has basically turned into a free for all fight no matter which faction is played.

Minno

S10Reaper wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

scubanj1ub17_ESO wrote: »

There are two unassailable facts here.

1) Ganking hurts the game. Takes the fun out of it. Us players who don't PvP come here to get our xp by doing the dailies. If players want to PvP go fight at the keeps. Sneaking around and attacking other players while they're talking to an NPC or fighting mobs already is not PvP. It's immature. It does not take skill. It is tantamount to hitting a man with his back turned. Those that are defending the practice, I'm sure you're the ones doing it and feel the need to defend it because you know how wrong it is. If you're life is so empty you have to ruin other people's time in the game maybe you need to get a better life? Just wait until you graduate middle school. It gets better.

I defend ganking all the time but I don't do it. I would probably get killed. My DPS is crap.

Skill is irrelevant. PvP is ESO is a war, not a tournament.

Your comments are poor logic. If someone defends something, you claim it is because they know it is wrong? And if they don't defend it, I suppose you would say that they admit it is wrong in their silence? Instead of actually having a discussion, you are publicly stating that you will not listen to any arguments that oppose the opinion you already have.

Get your XP elsewhere. You are the problem. If someone attacks you, it is PvP by definition. You are an enemy combatant. You are in a war zone. The game isn't designed to pander to you and give you everything you want the way you want it. Calling others immature won't make that so. It is also a clear case the pot calling the kettle black. Complaining about dying in a PvP war zone is about as immature a it gets. Adults should understand that you don't always get what you want handed to you.

Tell me the logic in a faction that ganks it's own faction. ESO faction pvp has basically turned into a free for all fight no matter which faction is played.

Ganking itself is encouraged not illegal.
In fact, the only ganking behavior in the game is when players tried to exploit ways into gates without taking keeps first.

Rest is fair game, sadly.

ShadoPanauin

S10Reaper wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

scubanj1ub17_ESO wrote: »

There are two unassailable facts here.

1) Ganking hurts the game. Takes the fun out of it. Us players who don't PvP come here to get our xp by doing the dailies. If players want to PvP go fight at the keeps. Sneaking around and attacking other players while they're talking to an NPC or fighting mobs already is not PvP. It's immature. It does not take skill. It is tantamount to hitting a man with his back turned. Those that are defending the practice, I'm sure you're the ones doing it and feel the need to defend it because you know how wrong it is. If you're life is so empty you have to ruin other people's time in the game maybe you need to get a better life? Just wait until you graduate middle school. It gets better.

I defend ganking all the time but I don't do it. I would probably get killed. My DPS is crap.

Skill is irrelevant. PvP is ESO is a war, not a tournament.

Your comments are poor logic. If someone defends something, you claim it is because they know it is wrong? And if they don't defend it, I suppose you would say that they admit it is wrong in their silence? Instead of actually having a discussion, you are publicly stating that you will not listen to any arguments that oppose the opinion you already have.

Get your XP elsewhere. You are the problem. If someone attacks you, it is PvP by definition. You are an enemy combatant. You are in a war zone. The game isn't designed to pander to you and give you everything you want the way you want it. Calling others immature won't make that so. It is also a clear case the pot calling the kettle black. Complaining about dying in a PvP war zone is about as immature a it gets. Adults should understand that you don't always get what you want handed to you.

Tell me the logic in a faction that ganks it's own faction. ESO faction pvp has basically turned into a free for all fight no matter which faction is played.

Do not quest in Cyrodiil and not expect to be ganked. It is a PvP zone; if you wish to quest in a place you won't get ganked, go to a PvE zone. It's that simple.

riverdragon72

Ever since @wheeler verified/explained how/whys the gap closer/cc stun lock worked it has gotten 10 times worse in pvp. It's a nightblade ambush face humping free for all now. Thanks to a templar friend my record has been eight nightblades lovingly showing me how ambush works at fare farm, he kept us alive for quite awhile before he got the nightblade mating ritual as well. Truely a moment where I wish I was recording.

pelennor_fields

There are two solutions as I see it... The hard way and the easy way...

1. (the hard way) - Force everyone into one faction. Give an option at the login upon the update and all characters will be locked into the chosen alliance.

2. (the easy way) - Make a friendly fire toggle in the style of GTA Online. Some of us are already backstabbing each other - give us all the option to kill each other. Then when you see player "flappysack" who plays on another alliance hanging around your crew while you are taking a keep - kill him... Or not. The choice would be yours. The programming changes would be minimal and the results would be real. Perhaps the only difference being that a kill within the alliance would not force travel to a owned keep or wayshrine. You could revive on the spot if you wanted. Sure some people could troll.. But at least they can't stealth gank you and they are already trolling us and we can't do anything about it. At least with a friendly fire toggle we could kill them.

Or thinking on the fly here, how about a "traitor" option that allows friendly fire only against people with toons on multiple factions. You could work with them or waste them. Your pick. I think i like that the most!

americansteel

socivL wrote: »

KeplerMG wrote: »

It would be a much better game if people couldn't cross-realm. Cross-realming, along with bad combat system decisions (circumstantial or not) are what make ESO the breeding/festering ground for trolls/cheaters/expoilters that it is.

girls Like bad-boys

those girls end up getting cheated and or mistreated. and wonder why.

S10Reaper

ShadoPanauin wrote: »

S10Reaper wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

scubanj1ub17_ESO wrote: »

There are two unassailable facts here.

1) Ganking hurts the game. Takes the fun out of it. Us players who don't PvP come here to get our xp by doing the dailies. If players want to PvP go fight at the keeps. Sneaking around and attacking other players while they're talking to an NPC or fighting mobs already is not PvP. It's immature. It does not take skill. It is tantamount to hitting a man with his back turned. Those that are defending the practice, I'm sure you're the ones doing it and feel the need to defend it because you know how wrong it is. If you're life is so empty you have to ruin other people's time in the game maybe you need to get a better life? Just wait until you graduate middle school. It gets better.

I defend ganking all the time but I don't do it. I would probably get killed. My DPS is crap.

Skill is irrelevant. PvP is ESO is a war, not a tournament.

Your comments are poor logic. If someone defends something, you claim it is because they know it is wrong? And if they don't defend it, I suppose you would say that they admit it is wrong in their silence? Instead of actually having a discussion, you are publicly stating that you will not listen to any arguments that oppose the opinion you already have.

Get your XP elsewhere. You are the problem. If someone attacks you, it is PvP by definition. You are an enemy combatant. You are in a war zone. The game isn't designed to pander to you and give you everything you want the way you want it. Calling others immature won't make that so. It is also a clear case the pot calling the kettle black. Complaining about dying in a PvP war zone is about as immature a it gets. Adults should understand that you don't always get what you want handed to you.

Tell me the logic in a faction that ganks it's own faction. ESO faction pvp has basically turned into a free for all fight no matter which faction is played.

Do not quest in Cyrodiil and not expect to be ganked. It is a PvP zone; if you wish to quest in a place you won't get ganked, go to a PvE zone. It's that simple.

So when Ebonheart players immediately swap to their Aldmeri characters to gank other Ebonheart players just so they can play on their Ebonheart characters in certain farm spots completely makes sense

S10Reaper

pelennor_fields wrote: »

There are two solutions as I see it... The hard way and the easy way...

1. (the hard way) - Force everyone into one faction. Give an option at the login upon the update and all characters will be locked into the chosen alliance.

2. (the easy way) - Make a friendly fire toggle in the style of GTA Online. Some of us are already backstabbing each other - give us all the option to kill each other. Then when you see player "flappysack" who plays on another alliance hanging around your crew while you are taking a keep - kill him... Or not. The choice would be yours. The programming changes would be minimal and the results would be real. Perhaps the only difference being that a kill within the alliance would not force travel to a owned keep or wayshrine. You could revive on the spot if you wanted. Sure some people could troll.. But at least they can't stealth gank you and they are already trolling us and we can't do anything about it. At least with a friendly fire toggle we could kill them.

Or thinking on the fly here, how about a "traitor" option that allows friendly fire only against people with toons on multiple factions. You could work with them or waste them. Your pick. I think i like that the most!

If you have heard of a game called Aion it forces faction choice one the first character is made on account. Traitor option sounds good also

kevlarto_ESO

Flip flopping factions in the same campaign has been a complaint I have had for a long time, this is three faction warfare, we pick a faction we fight for it we die for it, we support it, with this willy nilly system, there is no faction pride no campaign pride, people switch factions at the drop of a hat for personal gain not factional support, I know it is not going to change, I just wish ZOS would have followed the DAOC model a little closer in this area. I am following development of Camelot Unchained, sound like they are following the DAOC model a lot closer, will see what the future holds for that game and the future of ESO.