Justice System Contradiction

Demnvath

Hello.

Am a representative of the french roleplay community TESORP and I notice a LITTLE problem with the Justice System.

Proud member of the Ebonheart Pact, I travelled to Glenumbria and kill some Daggerfall Alliance soldiers in a military camp. Daggerfall guards attacked me, and, tired, I returned to Mournhold. And then, what a surprise, ordinators attacked me ! Why ordinators attack me when I'm just a HERO who BUTCHERED the ENNEMY ? Neither the banker do not want to speak to me? WHY?!

It's ridiculous. It's ok the guards attack you when you rob the citizens of your faction, but why do they attack you when you kill ennemies? It's, again, a big contradiction of the silver and gold campaigns which send you in other places with friendly ennemies everywhere. Patch it please. I do not want ordinators attacking me for the kill of ennemy soldiers !

eventide03b14a_ESO

Because they half-assed the justice system, but people are raving about the no stat fluff clothing you can steal. The justice system is the most over-hyped thing they have come out with yet. Sorry folks but it could have been so much better.

Jennifur_Vultee

Because bounties are Tamriel wide to prevent someone from going to Daggerfall committing all sorts of crimes then retreating to Mournhold to have no consequences until the bounty dissipated. Its like Oblivion's justice system where telepathy is used to spread word of your criminal status across Cyrodiil instead of like in Skyrim where a crime committed in one hold wasn't known in a different hold. If you don't want to deal with the consequences of your actions then don't do the crime.

When you go to the other faction areas for Cadwell's Silver and Goldyou're being sent by Meridia to experience their struggles as though you washed up there, to get to know them as a people and their struggles. You may see them as the enemy but they see you as one of them so when you attack them you're committing a crime not fighting your war.

Demnvath

The hole thing about Meridia and the Cadwell's Silver and Gold is a masquerade to add content to the game. Don't try to explain me why it's logic, it's not.

By the way, dunmers are slavers, and killing some breton peasants is absolutely not a problem, since they are considered not more as animals.

Being killed by ordinators for the kill of a breton knight, or being killed by a Skywatch guard for the kill of a nord barbarian in Riften, it's absolutely not logic.
Something must be done with this Justice System to make it more logic. To rob a grandma in Wayrest can't be punished in Kragenmoor! Be logic, you n'wah !

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Inappropriate Content and Language]

vovus69

Y'all criminals looks alile - it all war until you will be executed for crimes against humanity...

Demnvath

vovus69 wrote: »

Y'all criminals looks alile - it all war until you will be executed for crimes against humanity...

What humanity? It's a game about elven, lizardfolks, drunk barbarians, slaves and Molag Bal as the Prince of R.ape ! Don't bother people with crimes against humanity. 60% of the Tamriel population is NOT human., and in the remaining 40%, bretons are half-breeds elves.

But you are all off topic. I talk you about logic, and you talk me about Nuremberg tribunal and other things that do NOT exist on Nirn.

NewBlacksmurf

Demnvath wrote: »

Hello.

Am a representative of the french roleplay community TESORP and I notice a LITTLE problem with the Justice System.


It's ridiculous. It's ok the guards attack you when you rob the citizens of your faction, but why do they attack you when you kill ennemies? It's, again, a big contradiction of the silver and gold campaigns which send you in other places with friendly ennemies everywhere. Patch it please. I do not want ordinators attacking me for the kill of ennemy soldiers !

THIS!!!!!
Which is why the whole silver/gold quest system needs to go OUT the door ASAP.

*why...because of the above. It contradicts with the story and the entire "At war" idea.
**How or what takes it place. Well how about having a PvE Cyrodil with the shards, etc (and PvP too) but it would be campaign based as some of us like PvP while others prefer PvE.

Coqualier

In all other country of Tamriel, the Pact, Covenant and Dominion used odious method to affect the people of their ennemies. Crush the eggs of Argonian, execute civils, use necromancy.

Is a fictional universe. This racism, horror, blood, untolerance. What is actually horrible in real life is natural in the game. So why you can't going to do the bad job of assassins, sabotage, or other ?

So in the "RolePlay" they aren't all the men which was defeat Molag Bal, saved Tamriel, and going to other alliance because... Meridia, an Daedric Prince want to... (Ok, stop, why Meridia was the good girl of the story ?)

And if you kill guard or soldier or civilian in Daggerfall. Why Ordonnator going to kill you because you defeat enemies of Morrowind ?

For me, "Justice system" it is an attempt to give more playing time to players. But he does not care much of the role play . Which is a shame . Have a nice day.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Inappropriate Content and Language]

mrvbalc

Murder is murder whether u kill a good guy or bad guy. If you kill someone you have to face justice (though it is swift and sometimes brutal). End of story.

onlinegamer1

Demnvath wrote: »

Hello.

Am a representative of the french roleplay community TESORP and I notice a LITTLE problem with the Justice System.

Proud member of the Ebonheart Pact, I travelled to Glenumbria and kill some Daggerfall Alliance soldiers in a military camp. Daggerfall guards attacked me, and, tired, I returned to Mournhold. And then, what a surprise, ordinators attacked me ! Why ordinators attack me when I'm just a HERO who BUTCHERED the ENNEMY ? Neither the banker do not want to speak to me? WHY?!

It's ridiculous. It's ok the guards attack you when you rob the citizens of your faction, but why do they attack you when you kill ennemies? It's, again, a big contradiction of the silver and gold campaigns which send you in other places with friendly ennemies everywhere. Patch it please. I do not want ordinators attacking me for the kill of ennemy soldiers !

Because roleplaying is irrelevant to an MMORPG. If you let people steal/kill in other faction zones, they simply would, and never have to interact with the "Justice" system at all. i.e. it would be an exploit.

Try to remember, Roleplaying is up to YOU, not the game engine mechanics. The game engine mechanics are designed for regular players.

Demnvath

mrvbalc wrote: »

Murder is murder whether u kill a good guy or bad guy. If you kill someone you have to face justice (though it is swift and sometimes brutal). End of story.

No.

Or, yes. And you go in jail immediately for having kill people in Cyrodiil. Ridiculous. People don't think on this forum?

Demnvath

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Demnvath wrote: »

Hello.

Am a representative of the french roleplay community TESORP and I notice a LITTLE problem with the Justice System.

Proud member of the Ebonheart Pact, I travelled to Glenumbria and kill some Daggerfall Alliance soldiers in a military camp. Daggerfall guards attacked me, and, tired, I returned to Mournhold. And then, what a surprise, ordinators attacked me ! Why ordinators attack me when I'm just a HERO who BUTCHERED the ENNEMY ? Neither the banker do not want to speak to me? WHY?!

It's ridiculous. It's ok the guards attack you when you rob the citizens of your faction, but why do they attack you when you kill ennemies? It's, again, a big contradiction of the silver and gold campaigns which send you in other places with friendly ennemies everywhere. Patch it please. I do not want ordinators attacking me for the kill of ennemy soldiers !

Because roleplaying is irrelevant to an MMORPG. If you let people steal/kill in other faction zones, they simply would, and never have to interact with the "Justice" system at all. i.e. it would be an exploit.

Try to remember, Roleplaying is up to YOU, not the game engine mechanics. The game engine mechanics are designed for regular players.

MMORPG. MMORolePlayingGame. thanks. Goodbye.

onlinegamer1

Demnvath wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Demnvath wrote: »

Hello.

Am a representative of the french roleplay community TESORP and I notice a LITTLE problem with the Justice System.

Proud member of the Ebonheart Pact, I travelled to Glenumbria and kill some Daggerfall Alliance soldiers in a military camp. Daggerfall guards attacked me, and, tired, I returned to Mournhold. And then, what a surprise, ordinators attacked me ! Why ordinators attack me when I'm just a HERO who BUTCHERED the ENNEMY ? Neither the banker do not want to speak to me? WHY?!

It's ridiculous. It's ok the guards attack you when you rob the citizens of your faction, but why do they attack you when you kill ennemies? It's, again, a big contradiction of the silver and gold campaigns which send you in other places with friendly ennemies everywhere. Patch it please. I do not want ordinators attacking me for the kill of ennemy soldiers !

Because roleplaying is irrelevant to an MMORPG. If you let people steal/kill in other faction zones, they simply would, and never have to interact with the "Justice" system at all. i.e. it would be an exploit.

Try to remember, Roleplaying is up to YOU, not the game engine mechanics. The game engine mechanics are designed for regular players.

MMORPG. MMORolePlayingGame. thanks. Goodbye.

Massively Multiplayer Online Roll Playing Game.
Has nothing to do with roleplaying.

Coqualier

Massively Multiplayer Online Roll Playing Game.
Has nothing to do with roleplaying.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massively_multiplayer_online_role-playing_game

No.

Demnvath

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Demnvath wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Demnvath wrote: »

Hello.

Am a representative of the french roleplay community TESORP and I notice a LITTLE problem with the Justice System.

Proud member of the Ebonheart Pact, I travelled to Glenumbria and kill some Daggerfall Alliance soldiers in a military camp. Daggerfall guards attacked me, and, tired, I returned to Mournhold. And then, what a surprise, ordinators attacked me ! Why ordinators attack me when I'm just a HERO who BUTCHERED the ENNEMY ? Neither the banker do not want to speak to me? WHY?!

It's ridiculous. It's ok the guards attack you when you rob the citizens of your faction, but why do they attack you when you kill ennemies? It's, again, a big contradiction of the silver and gold campaigns which send you in other places with friendly ennemies everywhere. Patch it please. I do not want ordinators attacking me for the kill of ennemy soldiers !

Because roleplaying is irrelevant to an MMORPG. If you let people steal/kill in other faction zones, they simply would, and never have to interact with the "Justice" system at all. i.e. it would be an exploit.

Try to remember, Roleplaying is up to YOU, not the game engine mechanics. The game engine mechanics are designed for regular players.

MMORPG. MMORolePlayingGame. thanks. Goodbye.

Massively Multiplayer Online Roll Playing Game.
Has nothing to do with roleplaying.

What is wrong with you, dude ? xD
ROLE. ROLE ! Not roll x)

That's a roll playing game -> Roll play

In short, you're off topic.

onlinegamer1

Coqualier wrote: »

Massively Multiplayer Online Roll Playing Game.
Has nothing to do with roleplaying.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massively_multiplayer_online_role-playing_game

No.

Rule of Me: Roleplayers are a plague on MMORPGs, and should all be banned so that there is less lag and clutter in the chat window. And most certainly, no developer time should be spent on making any kind of game mechanic or system to support roleplaying. Developer time should only be spent on making content and systems for real players.

And it is on topic, as I pointed out, it would be an easy exploit for regular players to bypass justice system by going to silver/gold zones to open containers.

Coqualier

An MMORPG should actually think about ALL the players. That 's why the game mechanics are designed for all and not just for those seeking immersion. BUT. It's not a reason for denigrate why you create a game with an univers you invent for a stronger experience.

You can't again and again said "tolerance for all" and spit on the coherence of your creation. It's the same for Justice System, Veteran System or when you look a vampire and you can"t doing nothing... It's not "The Elder Scroll", TeS it's a Role Play Game with an story, an univers, and not just a "game mechanic" for "regular players", because roleplaygamers it's a regular players" with passion.

"onlinegamer1" =

the only scourge of an MMORPG are the people who like you, denigrates the passions of others to his. Whether for roleplay or anything else. All players can play as they want , the important thing is to respect what they do. that's it, the openness.

onlinegamer1

The fact that you think there should be game mechanics for roleplaying means you have absolutely no idea what the definition of "roleplaying" is.

Demnvath

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

The fact that you think there should be game mechanics for roleplaying means you have absolutely no idea what the definition of "roleplaying" is.

Please don't pollute the topic. Thanks. Nobody cares about "your" definition of roleplaying.

This topic stands to denounce a Justice System problem, not to let you babbling about anything else.

Coqualier

Or you can not imagine what it is ? Who are you to judge , the designer of " role playing " ? You who think we should ban people for a passion, and now attacks other denigrating them again and again . Puts you in question to ask you if " yes or no " it worth it to be as hostile as the others are not like you, you like.

this conversation is over, MJ settle this story if they deem it neccessary .

have good day

onlinegamer1

Demnvath wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

The fact that you think there should be game mechanics for roleplaying means you have absolutely no idea what the definition of "roleplaying" is.

Please don't pollute the topic. Thanks. Nobody cares about "your" definition of roleplaying.

This topic stands to denounce a Justice System problem, not to let you babbling about anything else.

This topic is over, I already pointed it that it would be a GAME EXPLOIT to allow people to steal without repercussions. Roleplaying is irrelevant to that fact.

dharbert

Ah, RP'ers......

The .001% of ESO. Sure, let's re-design the game to keep all 37 of you happy....

yodased

lol apparently roleplaying people are not 'real' to some people. I may not join in on the purple talk, nor really understand it, but I'm not actively going to try and antagonize nor suggest they be banned lol. Talk about fascist behavior, jeez.

To the OP though, the game mechanics make it so you are no longer part of the pact when you are in silver and gold, whether you like that or not, it is the way it is.

In order for them to do what you want they would literally have to scrap the cadwell's portion of the game and let you level through there as a pact person, which would require rewrites and voice overs for the entire thing x3, soooo that will happen exactly never.

If you want to r.p. then turn off the killing of innocents and go and murder all the red you want, you won't have to worry about it.

TL:DR never gonna happen.

onlinegamer1

dharbert wrote: »

Ah, RP'ers......

The .001% of ESO. Sure, let's re-design the game to keep all 37 of you happy....

QFT. These people will be the F2Ps anyway. No lost revenue there.

RakshaTheKhajiit

I agree with OP that its kinda dumb. Looks like something that is not implemented (yet, I hope it will be eventually).

Not sure if its a balance thing. Who cares if someone steals and runs away to other zones, to wait for bounty to disappear? You can do that now anyway by sitting in any solo or group dungeon. No one will be able to farm gold that way due to fence limits.

I personally have special characters in EP and DC factions that will be slaying EP and DC higherups (for the good of all Tamriel united under glorious AD), and when I will feel like playing on AD zones with them, I guess I'll just pay off my bounty.

Sue_D_Nim

RakshaTheKhajiit wrote: »

Not sure if its a balance thing. Who cares if someone steals and runs away to other zones, to wait for bounty to disappear? You can do that now anyway by sitting in any solo or group dungeon. No one will be able to farm gold that way due to fence limits.

Heck, you can do it by hunkering down behind any building where the guards don't patrol.

frank.bindb16_ESO

Sue_D_Nim wrote: »

RakshaTheKhajiit wrote: »

Not sure if its a balance thing. Who cares if someone steals and runs away to other zones, to wait for bounty to disappear? You can do that now anyway by sitting in any solo or group dungeon. No one will be able to farm gold that way due to fence limits.

Heck, you can do it by hunkering down behind any building where the guards don't patrol.

It's more easy, you can log out at a save place, play one of your twinks and coming back after 2 hours or so your bounty has gone. I hope they will change this until release. I think the bounty should only fall, while playing the character.

frank.bindb16_ESO

RakshaTheKhajiit wrote: »

Not sure if its a balance thing. Who cares if someone steals and runs away to other zones, to wait for bounty to disappear? You can do that now anyway by sitting in any solo or group dungeon. No one will be able to farm gold that way due to fence limits.

You can farm gold in this way, cause you can raise the limit. After the first skillpoint it raises from 50 to 120. And you can raise it 4 times. And if I remember correctly a stack counts 1 item only.

Demnvath

Robing is all about making money with ease... I don't see the problem

Vordae

Coqualier wrote: »

In all other country of Tamriel, the Pact, Covenant and Dominion used odious method to affect the people of their ennemies. Crush the eggs of Argonian, execute civils, use necromancy.

Is a fictional universe. This racism, horror, blood, untolerance. What is actually horrible in real life is natural in the game. So why you can't going to do the bad job of assassins, sabotage, or other ?

So in the "RolePlay" they aren't all the men which was defeat Molag Bal, saved Tamriel, and going to other alliance because... Meridia, an Daedric Prince want to... (Ok, stop, why Meridia was the good girl of the story ?)

And if you kill guard or soldier or civilian in Daggerfall. Why Ordonnator going to kill you because you defeat enemies of Morrowind ?

For me, "Justice system" it is an attempt to give more playing time to players. But he does not care much of the role play . Which is a shame . Have a nice day.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Inappropriate Content and Language]

If you want the system to be that way then they have to function as separate realms. You would no longer be able to teleport any were into enemy territory. You would have to travel on foot or horse from you home realm to were you want to attack. That could take lots of time traveling. Players of the opposing faction would be able to openly attack you if they found you in there territory as you are basically just breaking the law even being there. You are not talking about a Justice system. You are talking about a war system. This already exists in the game. It is called Cyrodiil. You can go there and kill the enemy faction and your own faction rewards you for it and calls you a hero.

Kragorn

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

Because bounties are Tamriel wide to prevent someone from going to Daggerfall committing all sorts of crimes then retreating to Mournhold to have no consequences until the bounty dissipated.

So this entire over-hyped and 'eagerly' anticipated system is fatally flawed, 'logic' wise, to prevent exploits.

If something is holed below the water-line it's time to abandon ship, not jump on and hope the bilge pumps work.