Templars backlash

daedalusAI

Changing Backlash’s final damage so it no longer critically strikes prevents the Templar from reaching the damage cap too easily with a high Critical Strike rating.

I'm not too sure if I understand that change.
How does the change that backlash can no longer be a critical strike prevent a crit heavy build form quickly reaching the maximum amount of damage stored?
Or was there some wonky mechanic before that counted backlash's final damage towards the amount stored?

Destruent

daedalusAI wrote: »

Changing Backlash’s final damage so it no longer critically strikes prevents the Templar from reaching the damage cap too easily with a high Critical Strike rating.

I'm not too sure if I understand that change.
How does the change that backlash can no longer be a critical strike prevent a crit heavy build form quickly reaching the maximum amount of damage stored?
Or was there some wonky mechanic before that counted backlash's final damage towards the amount stored?

No...but if you stored for a final explosion of 15k and it critted you reached the cap. This is now not possible anymore.

ZOS_KevinO

Hey everyone,

We moved the thread from the German "General Discussion" to the English "Combat & Character Mechanics" section, since it is fitting better in here.

daedalusAI

Destruent wrote: »

daedalusAI wrote: »

Changing Backlash’s final damage so it no longer critically strikes prevents the Templar from reaching the damage cap too easily with a high Critical Strike rating.

I'm not too sure if I understand that change.
How does the change that backlash can no longer be a critical strike prevent a crit heavy build form quickly reaching the maximum amount of damage stored?
Or was there some wonky mechanic before that counted backlash's final damage towards the amount stored?

No...but if you stored for a final explosion of 15k and it critted you reached the cap. This is now not possible anymore.

That explanation doesn't help me.

Currently my purifying light can store 21k.
Before the patch the amount stored up to the full 21k could be a critical strike - now it can't be.

If I have a high critical strike chance I reach the maximum amount quickly either way.

If indeed your goal was to prevent a templar from reaching the cap too quickly shouldn't you deny him that critical strikes count towards the amount stored and thus reducing the chance that I'm able to to fill the 21k in 6 seconds instead of just removing the critical strike chance of the released damage?

danno8

Since you can crit on every hit leading up to the explosion, having the explosion also crit is like having all the damage you just did crit a second time.

I think he worded his reasoning poorly. I think what he means is that the damage should not be able to double dip into crit chance. The same way that the explosion is reduced by battle spirit, but the build up is not (and in fact they gave the build up a bonus 50% boost to copied damage against other players.)

This was primarily done for PvP. In PvE you will reach the cap easily every time high crit chance or not.

daedalusAI

danno8 wrote: »

Since you can crit on every hit leading up to the explosion, having the explosion also crit is like having all the damage you just did crit a second time.

I think he worded his reasoning poorly. I think what he means is that the damage should not be able to double dip into crit chance. The same way that the explosion is reduced by battle spirit, but the build up is not (and in fact they gave the build up a bonus 50% boost to copied damage against other players.)

This was primarily done for PvP. In PvE you will reach the cap easily every time high crit chance or not.

That makes sense as a fix to not being able to double dip into the stored damage if it's a critical strike.
But considering the official explanation I'm still not too sure what their actual goal was: "...from reaching the cap too easily with a high critical rating" while taking a about the damage cap of backlash and that its final damage isn't a critical strike anymore.

technohic

They wanted the payoff to be better at the end so it could be used as burst. I've been testing it a bit on NPCs and it definitely does that better than before the patch for me. I need to hit Cyrodiil to see if it is effective. Can't slot everything and I feel like I may get more bang for my buck using something for Empower before big hits rather than waiting for the delayed burst.

daedalusAI

technohic wrote: »

They wanted the payoff to be better at the end so it could be used as burst. I've been testing it a bit on NPCs and it definitely does that better than before the patch for me. I need to hit Cyrodiil to see if it is effective. Can't slot everything and I feel like I may get more bang for my buck using something for Empower before big hits rather than waiting for the delayed burst.

I'm not seeing a major payoff now.
The instant damage is meager, the damage storing is still the same as before and the final damage can now only be as high as your maximum storage capacity of backlash - whereas before if your final damage was a critical strike that was massive burst.

It's still a burst ability now due to the high storage capacity of backlash - but if you consider it takes 6 seconds of being armed and the fact that it can't be a critical strike anymore somewhat lessens the burst potential.

Rohaus

I tried it last night in PvP. Seems pretty good in terms of burst damage and it compliments Jabs quite well.

technohic

daedalusAI wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

They wanted the payoff to be better at the end so it could be used as burst. I've been testing it a bit on NPCs and it definitely does that better than before the patch for me. I need to hit Cyrodiil to see if it is effective. Can't slot everything and I feel like I may get more bang for my buck using something for Empower before big hits rather than waiting for the delayed burst.

I'm not seeing a major payoff now.
The instant damage is meager, the damage storing is still the same as before and the final damage can now only be as high as your maximum storage capacity of backlash - whereas before if your final damage was a critical strike that was massive burst.

It's still a burst ability now due to the high storage capacity of backlash - but if you consider it takes 6 seconds of being armed and the fact that it can't be a critical strike anymore somewhat lessens the burst potential.

PvE? Just wondering as critical hits are your concern where in PvP, they still help but raw damage is more reliable. They seemed to have been aiming at making it more viable in PvP because before; it was suffering from Battle Spirits damage reduction twice. They removed that and made a monster for a bit on PTS because it was then filling up fast and doing way more damage than intended. The way they handled I am assuming was because they found an issue with it now getting crit twice.

This is all speculation of course so I hate to tell you that and give everyone a reason to complain that PvE is ruined because of PvP, but it just seems to be where it made strides. Add to it that it no longer be blocked and it kind of increases my suspicion.

danno8

daedalusAI wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

They wanted the payoff to be better at the end so it could be used as burst. I've been testing it a bit on NPCs and it definitely does that better than before the patch for me. I need to hit Cyrodiil to see if it is effective. Can't slot everything and I feel like I may get more bang for my buck using something for Empower before big hits rather than waiting for the delayed burst.

I'm not seeing a major payoff now.
The instant damage is meager, the damage storing is still the same as before and the final damage can now only be as high as your maximum storage capacity of backlash - whereas before if your final damage was a critical strike that was massive burst.

It's still a burst ability now due to the high storage capacity of backlash - but if you consider it takes 6 seconds of being armed and the fact that it can't be a critical strike anymore somewhat lessens the burst potential.

While the explosion could crit before, it could not crit any higher than the cap.

Also, keep in mind that they did increase the amount of damage that gets copied. It's at 25% now whereas before it was at 20% (I think).

Again, in PvE this skill hasn't changed at all, since hitting the cap was easy before and after. In PvP though (without actually testing) it should be much better now since you go from 20 to 25%, AND they gave a bonus 50% on top of that for build up damage, AND they made it unblockable.

It was absolute crap before in PvP, now it should hit for at least a few thousand if you can manage to get 10,000 damage in in those 6 seconds.

Brutusmax1mus

Anyone have some videos of this in pvp?

daedalusAI

technohic wrote: »

daedalusAI wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

They wanted the payoff to be better at the end so it could be used as burst. I've been testing it a bit on NPCs and it definitely does that better than before the patch for me. I need to hit Cyrodiil to see if it is effective. Can't slot everything and I feel like I may get more bang for my buck using something for Empower before big hits rather than waiting for the delayed burst.

I'm not seeing a major payoff now.
The instant damage is meager, the damage storing is still the same as before and the final damage can now only be as high as your maximum storage capacity of backlash - whereas before if your final damage was a critical strike that was massive burst.

It's still a burst ability now due to the high storage capacity of backlash - but if you consider it takes 6 seconds of being armed and the fact that it can't be a critical strike anymore somewhat lessens the burst potential.

PvE? Just wondering as critical hits are your concern where in PvP, they still help but raw damage is more reliable. They seemed to have been aiming at making it more viable in PvP because before; it was suffering from Battle Spirits damage reduction twice. They removed that and made a monster for a bit on PTS because it was then filling up fast and doing way more damage than intended. The way they handled I am assuming was because they found an issue with it now getting crit twice.

This is all speculation of course so I hate to tell you that and give everyone a reason to complain that PvE is ruined because of PvP, but it just seems to be where it made strides. Add to it that it no longer be blocked and it kind of increases my suspicion.

The only issue I have if that the developer's comment explains an entirely different reason as to what was actually implemented.

I still like backlash either way.

timidobserver

The developer comments and patch notes need to be revised. They make no sense the way they are worded.

The ability is very good against tank builds and stam builds. Decent against sorcs. Useless against other Templar.