Dear ZoS - We appreciate the public apology on the Mistaken Bans. Thank you!

bob_jeko

Im just curious, but all the suspended ppl (the ppl that got their accounts activated again after being investigated), is it possible thet they had duped items traded to them?

Swampster

KerinKor wrote: »

KerinKor wrote: »

Finally got my forum account unbanned.

I'll assume the 1 LOL that post received was from one of said trolls, as no one who suffered from their hate would think it funny.

Actually no you'd be wrong, I posted the LOL.. and what I thought was funny in an ironic sense was your desire for 'retribution' and expecting the CSR to facilitate that for you..

Magdalina

Ironclap wrote: »

A few false positives is a small price to pay for getting rid of exploiters

This logic, while being seemingly reasonable, only works while you're not included in the "small price".
Personally, I think gold spammers, bots and exploiters didn't ruin my game. They make it annoying, yes, very annoying sometimes but I CAN still play. I'd rather have that than an account banned with no notice because they "accidentally sidesweeped some innocents". They worked it out COMPARATIVELY fast this time, but if overdoing it like that is okay...should I prepare to be banned after every patch or something? Just in case I fall in the "few false positives" again.
Imo, in this case it's better to let exploits slide than ban innocents. Exploits don't stop ME, a perfectly rule obeying paying customer, from playing. The ban sure did. It's also kinda humiliating - I've never ever been banned anywhere in my life.

Domander

[

MercyKilling

Just to point this out, as so many people seem to think otherwise....the Terms of Service you agree to every time you click the "play" button states at its most basic that Zenimax "owes" you nothing insofar as your account goes. Accidentally suspended? Oops. Here. We'll reactivate.
Oh, you think you were doing nothing wrong? Well, we do, and we don't have to explain ourselves to you.

Do I think it's bad that people are wrongfully being banned? Sure do.
However, Zenimax owes no explanations or reasons to anyone, and them stepping up like they did and offering that apology? That's going beyond what their own legal terminology dictates in the ToS.

I strongly suggest people READ the Terms of Service carefully, and if there's something you don't personally understand in them....ASK ABOUT IT. Ask for clarification in non-legal terms....I'm fairly certain the help/customer service people would be glad to explain it to you.

All that said and done...welcome back, those of you who are back.

Swampster

magdalina157eb17_ESO wrote: »

This logic, while being seemingly reasonable, only works while you're not included in the "small price".

As far as I'm concerned that's not true, as I mentioned in an earlier post while not in this game I have been swept up in broad ban hammer culls in other games previously and I accept it's a necessary action to maintain control of the game. So long as there is a properly run appeals process that is; and that doesn't take weeks to function.. Admittedly if I were banned for many days I'd be rather peeved, and probably take to ranting on forums too by that point!

magdalina157eb17_ESO wrote: »

Personally, I think gold spammers, bots and exploiters didn't ruin my game. They make it annoying, yes, very annoying sometimes but I CAN still play. I'd rather have that than an account banned with no notice because they "accidentally sidesweeped some innocents".

See if you think they're not ruining your game when you're effectivley and totally priced out of it due to insane inflation.. and the population dwindles to such an extent that it's really difficult to get groups due to the rife exploiting. Because if they do nothing that is what happens...

magdalina157eb17_ESO wrote: »

Imo, in this case it's better to let exploits slide than ban innocents. Exploits don't stop ME, a perfectly rule obeying paying customer, from playing. The ban sure did. It's also kinda humiliating - I've never ever been banned anywhere in my life.

I'm going to make an asusmption, possibly incorrectly that you've not played many MMO's previously? They can't let things like this slide as it can completely cripple the game and people end up leaving faster than rats on ship with a hole in it..

When all said and done it was a short term ban that was overturned when you appealed.. yes it's undoubtedly an annoyance, but it was the first of the many ban sweeps ahead.. hopefully due to the mistakes made during this one they'll be able to fine tune their systems so that there is far less collateral damage the next time!

I'm glad to see on appeal those who didn't do any wrong are getting re-instated and at a reasonable pace considering the scale of these things. OK, I'll concede that it's NEVER quick enough when you're on the receiving end Seeing that they are taking action of this sort gives me a little confidence for the future of the game (as it had been dwindling recently), they just need to do it with a little more finesse next time!

Cozy

bob_jeko wrote: »

Im just curious, but all the suspended ppl (the ppl that got their accounts activated again after being investigated), is it possible thet they had duped items traded to them?

No, seeing as I haven't traded with anyone or used a guild bank.

theyancey

Excellent move! It shows that they do indeed listen to us.

Dergard

KerinKor wrote: »

Finally got my forum account unbanned.

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom, can we have an assurance that all the trolls who posted in the umpteen threads last night sneering and openly laughing at myself and every other innocent player protesting have received infractions or better for their behaviour.

I have copies of their posts if you need them. I'd post the names here but your mods would delete the post even though I feel every right to call them out for their behaviour.

This!
The hatefull speech we suffered yesterday was disgusting. Ban trolls. Reading through yesterdays threads you should identify lots of them.
They will never better themselves, because they are sick people. See here.

Kortak

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi @Miezi,

We made a mistake, and we're sincerely sorry about it. We've unbanned all accounts that we wrongfully identified as having cheated. The amount of people impacted by this was not in the thousands, though the number doesn't really matter--this happening to a single one is too many. We do understand what led to this unfortunate error, and have already taken measures to improve our process.

The help portal going down last night was due to a maintenance. We did not take it down to keep people from submitting help requests. The timing was regrettable, and we got the help portal back up as quickly as possible.

We hope that additional info helps, and we appreciate you giving us a chance to answer your questions.

Kudos for this apology. Goes a long way. Mistakes happen..

keep up the good work

Magdalina

Swampster wrote: »

I'm going to make an asusmption, possibly incorrectly that you've not played many MMO's previously? They can't let things like this slide as it can completely cripple the game and people end up leaving faster than rats on ship with a hole in it..

When all said and done it was a short term ban that was overturned when you appealed.. yes it's undoubtedly an annoyance, but it was the first of the many ban sweeps ahead.. hopefully due to the mistakes made during this one they'll be able to fine tune their systems so that there is far less collateral damage the next time!

I'm glad to see on appeal those who didn't do any wrong are getting re-instated and at a reasonable pace considering the scale of these things. OK, I'll concede that it's NEVER quick enough when you're on the receiving end Seeing that they are taking action of this sort gives me a little confidence for the future of the game (as it had been dwindling recently), they just need to do it with a little more finesse next time!

True, this is more or less my first MMO=P
But just because it happens, I refuse to admit it normal>.> Anyway, even if it is inevitable, surely they could send an email notification at least, not ban without ANY notice? So I'd at least have an idea there's been a mistake, not some unspeakable crime I've accidentally commited after which my account'll be banned for life.
I love the game, and I tend to forgive mistakes, but if I ACCIDENTALLY get randomly banned again, I'm probably out, sad as it'd be.

That said, thanks for an intelligent response. The mood of some people around here is rather...frustrating for me.

cappaspada

bob_jeko wrote: »

Im just curious, but all the suspended ppl (the ppl that got their accounts activated again after being investigated), is it possible thet they had duped items traded to them?

Not me for sure. In this game i bought only 5 provisioning recipes of very low lvl from a guild store and picked up another recipe of low lvl from a guild bank.
The only things i traded with other players where white items to decostruct for levelling woodworking, blacksmithing and clothing. I have received several runes and foods from a guild mate (that was not banned ) but nothing that can be flagged as duped (i don't think that someone would risk to be baneed to dupe some Apple or bettle)
Teh only things i have that are copies are the items of the 7 explorer packs i received (6 are still in the mail) because the bank bug

Vodkaphile

bwilson.homeb16_ESO wrote: »

MissyJ wrote: »

Would be nice to have all the trolls and other ppl told off that they were wrong when they said, that we all deserved the ban. But no...it's okay that they kept trashing the banned playerbase even after the rest of us got banned from the forums too.

This.
100 times this.

Even now, the 'you got banned, you must've deserved it!' trolls have just changed their trolling to 'well maybe a few people didn't deserve it, but the rest of you did!'

I thought trolling was against the rules, but it seems defending yourself was frowned upon and the trolls were allowed to flourish without any censorship whatsoever

Most of the people like myself, not trolls, knew that the vast majority (99%) that were banned were banned for the right reason. It is unfortunate that there was collateral damage; and ZoS has taken the steps to rectify this. There is ALWAYS collateral damage in ban sweeps. It sucks, but the game is in a much better place because of it, though I admit that is no consolation to those who couldn't play.

My largest point, was that coming to the forums and breaking ToS here is not the correct way to go about the process. I wouldn't be surprised if there's people now forum banned that were legitimate players because they chose to come here and slam everything about the game and curse at players and ZoS - always the wrong way to go about anything.

randomaffliction66

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi @Miezi,

We made a mistake, and we're sincerely sorry about it. We've unbanned all accounts that we wrongfully identified as having cheated. The amount of people impacted by this was not in the thousands, though the number doesn't really matter--this happening to a single one is too many. We do understand what led to this unfortunate error, and have already taken measures to improve our process.

The help portal going down last night was due to a maintenance. We did not take it down to keep people from submitting help requests. The timing was regrettable, and we got the help portal back up as quickly as possible.

We hope that additional info helps, and we appreciate you giving us a chance to answer your questions.

That's the first post I've seen from you that's actually made me feel like a " Customer " Rather than a dollar bill, thank you

Swampster

magdalina157eb17_ESO wrote: »

True, this is more or less my first MMO=P
But just because it happens, I refuse to admit it normal>.> Anyway, even if it is inevitable, surely they could send an email notification at least, not ban without ANY notice? So I'd at least have an idea there's been a mistake, not some unspeakable crime I've accidentally commited after which my account'll be banned for life.
I love the game, and I tend to forgive mistakes, but if I ACCIDENTALLY get randomly banned again, I'm probably out, sad as it'd be.

That said, thanks for an intelligent response. The mood of some people around here is rather...frustrating for me.

Well welcome to your 'first' mmo experience.. honestly, it's not all bad.. I'm still playing them upteen years after my first, and I'm not that much of a sucker for punishment really

I do agree, they haven't handled this very well in a PR sense.. and yeah, you're right, anyone caught up should have really received an email explaining what had happened. It's one thing I do think ZOS is really poor at... communication!

As for forums, for the most part I tend to stay away from them (I'm only lurking while I decide whether to go to the pub or not.. during the server downtime).. as with ANY mmo (well actually barring LoTRO) they're usually a cesspit of rampant negativity (mostly) and sometimes opposing illogical positivity.. and most sane people in between tend to get drowned out..lol

cappaspada

Vodkaphile wrote: »

bwilson.homeb16_ESO wrote: »

MissyJ wrote: »

Would be nice to have all the trolls and other ppl told off that they were wrong when they said, that we all deserved the ban. But no...it's okay that they kept trashing the banned playerbase even after the rest of us got banned from the forums too.

This.
100 times this.

Even now, the 'you got banned, you must've deserved it!' trolls have just changed their trolling to 'well maybe a few people didn't deserve it, but the rest of you did!'

I thought trolling was against the rules, but it seems defending yourself was frowned upon and the trolls were allowed to flourish without any censorship whatsoever

Most of the people like myself, not trolls, knew that the vast majority (99%) that were banned were banned for the right reason. It is unfortunate that there was collateral damage; and ZoS has taken the steps to rectify this. There is ALWAYS collateral damage in ban sweeps. It sucks, but the game is in a much better place because of it, though I admit that is no consolation to those who couldn't play.

My largest point, was that coming to the forums and breaking ToS here is not the correct way to go about the process. I wouldn't be surprised if there's people now forum banned that were legitimate players because they chose to come here and slam everything about the game and curse at players and ZoS - always the wrong way to go about anything.

Teh 99 % of the banned ppl were innocent and maybe the 1 % of them were guilty.

BenjaminKacher_ESO

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ Thanks for the reply. You are probably one of the best admins/mods on the forums, but you still did not answer his question about a public apology (one not on your forums) such as through twitter. I asked the same thing and have not received a response here:http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/82305/account-page-says-you-have-been-suspended-from-the-site?new=1

ZRage

I'm curious why they perma ban people, in fact a lot of people who are innocent.

Why instead not :

1. FIX the game bugs and exploits people are talking about on forums for days like, pub dungeon boss spawn, too much gold from low level mobs and dungeons and static places, even the bank issue I think it was reported back in beta... Same goes for gold sending with mail, why allowing that then ban random people that send gold to guild mates co-op together or co-use resources? Why allow something then ban for it how does it make sense?

2. Delete copied items or botted gold even characters in some cases? I'm curious why put a perma ban on 60€ license which is paid, this is I'd say anti-customer policy lol. In fact in some cases obviously by mistake or unfairly people are being banned I mean how can other people trust in this and why I need to care in game every time I open a chest kill a mob or send a mail to someone care if by some reason i won't be bugging game and getting banned for nothing. Just because it is game bug exploit or whatever. I'm serious some people have problem opening doors in this game you expect everybody to know what is a game bug what is intended and what isn't?

Seriously people are investing their time and money into this game It is really uncomfortable for me to do it when there is so many unknowns where I can get banned by simply playing the game. It is just unfair that you put a perma ban on this people WITHOUT BEING ABSOLUTELY SURE. I'm serious if you are about to delete someone 60 euro license I think you should at least have some proof or explanation what exactly they done and why the hell they deserve to get banned. Give this people chance to defend themselves because it is ridicilous enough, if person didn't cheat and you have no proof of them cheating what can they do other than say they didn't cheat.

I'm sorry to say but exploits exist because the product is bugged so why you burden everything on the customers this is something I cannot simply understand.

I want the cheaters and botters pay for what they do but this is not really a good way to handle this at least the apologies were done right.

The biggest paradox of hard punishment is that it never works like it should you can see all the psychology studies where in states with death sentence there is like 2 times more murders being done anyway than in those w/o death sentence.

Delete the character of cheaters and put a -100k gold balance on their account or equal to harm done and then they will need to work from zero this is way better solution than banning game license forever. Let them work in prison instead of hanging them period.

Kyotee0071

Audigy wrote: »

Kyotee0071 wrote: »

Nehemia wrote: »

"Banned innocent people"

Don't download youtube speed hacks so your account cannot be turned into a mindless bot of a gold seller.

I guess you missed the link to them admitting legitimate accounts were caught up in the ban..and after further investigation they were found of no issues breaking anything to do with the ToS.

Keep patting yourself on the back "grasshopper"...hopefully one day you fall of your high horse and learn some compassion.

They said "some", so please don't think all bans were not justified.

No one said that all bans were not justified. And in their link they said after investigations, the folks who broke no rules had their accounts restored.

This very community (not everyone, but many) quickly condemned anyone posting that they had been unjustly banned. Many snide comments were made to us.

It is vindication for us that the very company that suspended our accounts for no reason what so ever, also turned around an reinstated our Legitimate accounts - and made a public post stating that they banned many legitimate/innocent accounts that did not break the ToS in anyway.

Yet there are still people in this very thread that think everyone banned should of stayed banned. There's no winning with some people.

As I said earlier, before last night being banned had never even crossed my mind. I thought there was no way I could ever be banned because I do not cheat/exploit/harass players, or mouth off in zone chat and say childish, vulgar things.

Just like I don't sell or do drugs. I live my days never giving being arrested for a drug related crime a second thought.

I have never been banned, reprimanded, suspended from any game or forum until last night. It was shocking. It was also shocking that so many forum users were posting things like "great you most likely deserved it".. "I for one am glad they at least banned someone", "In my experience if you were banned you were guilty.". It's not an easy pill to swallow. I promise.

I know better now. I know that innocent people can be banned, and have to fight for their account back. It's not a pleasant feeling being called a "cheater/exploiter/botter" when you know you are 100 % innocent. I promise.

As easily as it hit many of us, it could very well be you next time. Or your best friend, your girlfriend, your wife/husband, favorite "guildy", or anyone close to you. Someone you know for a fact never cheated in any way.

Then maybe folks won't be so quick to judge others and condemn them.

I know my lesson was learned after last night. I just hope you don't have to experience it as well.

"If it could happen to me, it could happen to anyone" rings very true here. As I didn't expect to ever be banned in my life.

Decimus_Rex

Kyotee0071 wrote: »

Edit ** They apologized publicly, and that is all I feel a lot of us wanted (opinion).

Thank your ZoS for admitting your mistake:

That was a professional and classy move.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/82921/information-on-recent-account-bans

Edit End **


Just curious. My account was reinstated today. I was unjustly banned, then reinstated. I just received this:

"
Greetings!

After reviewing all of the necessary information, we have verified that you have not done anything to constitute a violation of our terms of service.

We sincerely apologize for the inconvenience this misplaced ban has caused you. However, I am happy to tell you that the ban on your account has been lifted. There will be no disciplinary actions on your account and your remaining game time will be unaffected.

We hope that from this point on, you continue to enjoy your time in Tamriel.

Warm Regards,

The Elder Scrolls Online Team


I'm thankful to be back and playing.

But it seems that ZoS very quickly posted a Sticky thread about Mass Banning all the cheaters, and they got what they deserved. When in fact many innocent people were banned who did nothing wrong.

A public acknowledgment from the Company would be great for the innocent bystanders caught up in the mayhem. I could care less about loss game, it's being accused while being innocent that shocked most of us, from both ZoS - and the general community on the forums.

I am enjoying the game, and will continue my support

Regards,

Kyo

Was your guild duping and you got caught in the cross fire ?

BmcD73

Ironclap wrote: »

A few false positives is a small price to pay for getting rid of exploiters

I was one that was banned and reinstated. I totally agree with you BUT when you make a mistake, you don't just fix it and move on. You need to do something to repair that relationship.

I spent 6 HOURS on hold yesterday trying to get in touch with support. 6 HOURS. there was no way I was not going to get in touch with someone because as far as I was concerned ZOS just stole $85 from me.

I've spend additional time trying to get my bank, all my items, and lost gold restored.

And still no "Here is what we are going to do to make it up to you" statement. Not even a hint of it.

I think everyone can understands mistakes. We all know this is a new game and there are plenty of bugs. But they don't seem interested in trying to repair good faith with the players.

I can forgive almost anything but the utter lack of any response to how they plan on making things right is absurd. I have already canceled my account and they have 14 days now to make things right. I have never hated a game I love so much. Currently it's about 60% fun and 40% frustrating. I see the potential and if they would just say anything, ANYTHING I would be bought in. We shall see.

KerinKor

Ironclap wrote: »

A few false positives is a small price to pay for getting rid of exploiters

I take it you weren't one of the several hundred then .. in my book that's not a 'few'.

Kyotee0071

Decimus_Rex wrote: »

Was your guild duping and you got caught in the cross fire ?

I'm not certain. I haven't started any tradeskills yet. I haven't used the guild bank, nor think I even have access to it. I logged in today for a bit and noticed the guild chat was way quieter than usual. But honestly, I have no idea.

Bottom line is they acknowledged their mistake publicly. That makes a lot of us at least feel a bit better.

Swampster

Decimus_Rex wrote: »

Was your guild duping and you got caught in the cross fire ?

I don't think we'll ever find out why people got caught up.. suffice to say ZOS's criteria was undoubtedly too broad in this instance.

We can all make guesses but we've no idea on what they were targetting.. well some would probably argue ZOS had no idea either.. lol

KerinKor

Swampster wrote: »

KerinKor wrote: »

KerinKor wrote: »

Finally got my forum account unbanned.

I'll assume the 1 LOL that post received was from one of said trolls, as no one who suffered from their hate would think it funny.

Actually no you'd be wrong, I posted the LOL.. and what I thought was funny in an ironic sense was your desire for 'retribution' and expecting the CSR to facilitate that for you..

Okay, you find the concept of retribution amusing .. I simply want the forums rules applying uniformly, apparently though you can't be rude to someone as that's not allowed, but you can ridicule them with impunity.

KerinKor

Decimus_Rex wrote: »

Kyotee0071 wrote: »

Edit ** They apologized publicly, and that is all I feel a lot of us wanted (opinion).

Thank your ZoS for admitting your mistake:

That was a professional and classy move.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/82921/information-on-recent-account-bans

Edit End **


Just curious. My account was reinstated today. I was unjustly banned, then reinstated. I just received this:

"
Greetings!

After reviewing all of the necessary information, we have verified that you have not done anything to constitute a violation of our terms of service.

We sincerely apologize for the inconvenience this misplaced ban has caused you. However, I am happy to tell you that the ban on your account has been lifted. There will be no disciplinary actions on your account and your remaining game time will be unaffected.

We hope that from this point on, you continue to enjoy your time in Tamriel.

Warm Regards,

The Elder Scrolls Online Team


I'm thankful to be back and playing.

But it seems that ZoS very quickly posted a Sticky thread about Mass Banning all the cheaters, and they got what they deserved. When in fact many innocent people were banned who did nothing wrong.

A public acknowledgment from the Company would be great for the innocent bystanders caught up in the mayhem. I could care less about loss game, it's being accused while being innocent that shocked most of us, from both ZoS - and the general community on the forums.

I am enjoying the game, and will continue my support

Regards,

Kyo

Was your guild duping and you got caught in the cross fire ?

Don't know about him but I'm not in a guild WITH a bank and have never bought a single thing from any other player, so there's no question of my duping in any way, shape or form.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

So mods can we get a lock on this thread? You guys already apologized publicly twice now yet doesnt seem to be enough. People throwing troll around should go look in the mirror. Trolling the CSRs calling them all kinds of names and demanding apologies etc is considered trolling in my book. Even after they basically capitulate in front of you guys thats still not good enough.

Kyotee0071

It's good enough for me, and I see no reason for this thread to go on. But I can't hold my tongue when people still spout off trollish remarks about banned people being automatically guilty of something.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

You know it takes two people to fight? If you cant hold your tongue maybe you shouldnt be here.

Swampster

KerinKor wrote: »

I simply want the forums rules applying uniformly, apparently though you can't be rude to someone as that's not allowed, but you can ridicule them with impunity.

That tends to be par the course on most forums in my experience...

It should have been down to the forum mods to clamp down on it last night as it was occuring, it was a poor show to be sure.. But retrospectively banning people due to comments they've made on a subject they thought to be correct at the time probably isn't ever going to happen, unless of course they crossed that 'rude' line and it was missed. I might be wrong of course and they broad brush ban people from the forums as well..