PTS Update 24 - Feedback Thread for Necromancer

Maulkin

gresiac wrote: »

Is this thread dead ?

We’re necromancers we can resurrect it whenever we please

ThePhantomThorn

A list
1: FIX BLASTBONES
2: either totem fears instantly or make shock reach stun again
3: FIX BLASTBONES
4: we need some sort of mobility. Most form and rat don’t count.
5: FIX BLASTBONES
6: add a class single target dot. Like sun fire or cripple?
7: FIX BLASTBONES
8: mage/archer need a buff. The damage is to low
9: FIX BLASTBONES


Did I mention that blastbones sucks?

ESO_Nightingale

i want the class to be more reliable. a blastbones ai improvement or even a change to make them consistently hit would seriously go a long way. Skull needs a faster projectile speed.

Nordic__Knights

As an player who owns elswyer id like to ask how this ever become an class and heres why
1)Main quest line EVERY CLASS has to use necromancy to move FORWARD. And is told by champion you work with " ill make an necromancer out of you yet"
2) 1 of the 5 champion's is an imperial necromancer
3) the main necromancer of elswyer is an Khajiit
So thats EVERY CLASS for main line STORY, imperial for an champion, and THE MAIN NECROMANCER BEING KHAJJIT!!!!!!!!!
How did you all ever pass all that up and make it an CLASS ?

Artorias24

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

Us an player who owns elswyer id like to ask how this ever become an class and heres why
1)Main quest line EVERY CLASS has to use necromancy to move FORWARD. And is told by champion you work with " ill make an necromancer out of you yet"
2) 1 of the 5 champion's is an imperial necromancer
3) the main necromancer of elswyer is an Khajiit
So thats EVERY race for main line store , imperial for an champion, and THE MAIN NECROMANCER BEING KHAJJIT!!!!!!!!!
How did you all ever pass all that up and make it an race ?

Eh what?

Nordic__Knights

Artorias24 wrote: »

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

Us an player who owns elswyer id like to ask how this ever become an class and heres why
1)Main quest line EVERY CLASS has to use necromancy to move FORWARD. And is told by champion you work with " ill make an necromancer out of you yet"
2) 1 of the 5 champion's is an imperial necromancer
3) the main necromancer of elswyer is an Khajiit
So thats EVERY race for main line store , imperial for an champion, and THE MAIN NECROMANCER BEING KHAJJIT!!!!!!!!!
How did you all ever pass all that up and make it an race ?

Eh what?

Sorry just seen where id made an miss wording an fixed

LukosCreyden

@Nordic__Knights still makes zero sense. Besides, this is a thread for class balancing, not whatever that was.

Nordic__Knights

LukosCreyden wrote: »

@Nordic__Knights still makes zero sense. Besides, this is a thread for class balancing, not whatever that was.

As an skill line necromancer could had been something great as an class its an let down from all views
What i was showing was how within the game way before the add EVERY CLASS HAD TO USE NECROMANCY was told by 1 of the 5 Champion's he'd turn us into one but yet with all that they made it an unpleasant class no-one is happy with never has been really fell they missed out making it something it should never of been as necromancy is the art of dark magic not the dark class
SO MY FEEDBACK WOULD BE revert it being an class and make it an skill as it should had been

Artorias24

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

LukosCreyden wrote: »

@Nordic__Knights still makes zero sense. Besides, this is a thread for class balancing, not whatever that was.

As an skill line necromancer could had been something great as an class its an let down from all views
What i was showing was how within the game way before the add EVERY CLASS HAD TO USE NECROMANCY was told by 1 of the 5 Champion's he'd turn us into one but yet with all that they made it an unpleasant class no-one is happy with never has been really fell they missed out making it something it should never of been as necromancy is the art of dark magic not the dark class

Necromancer was one of the classes that everyone wanted since release and we dont need another skill line with only 5 skills, 1 ult and a few passives. While current classes already have problems to slot all needed skills.

So a class was the right choice.

Nordic__Knights

Artorias24 wrote: »

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

LukosCreyden wrote: »

@Nordic__Knights still makes zero sense. Besides, this is a thread for class balancing, not whatever that was.

As an skill line necromancer could had been something great as an class its an let down from all views
What i was showing was how within the game way before the add EVERY CLASS HAD TO USE NECROMANCY was told by 1 of the 5 Champion's he'd turn us into one but yet with all that they made it an unpleasant class no-one is happy with never has been really fell they missed out making it something it should never of been as necromancy is the art of dark magic not the dark class

Necromancer was one of the classes that everyone wanted since release and we dont need another skill line with only 5 skills, 1 ult and a few passives. While current classes already have problems to slot all needed skills.

So a class was the right choice.

No one wanted it to be an class yes everyone want skills or the use of necromancy but never had i seen anyone say make it an class when it was told everyone tried saying it be better as an skill and how much of the necromancer skills are use 5 maybe 6 and its ult even as an class so yes as an skill line it still be used and fun to know necromancy

MCBIZZLE300

ThePhantomThorn wrote: »

A list
1: FIX BLASTBONES
2: either totem fears instantly or make shock reach stun again
3: FIX BLASTBONES
4: we need some sort of mobility. Most form and rat don’t count.
5: FIX BLASTBONES
6: add a class single target dot. Like sun fire or cripple?
7: FIX BLASTBONES
8: mage/archer need a buff. The damage is to low
9: FIX BLASTBONES


Did I mention that blastbones sucks?

agreed

LukosCreyden

@Nordic__Knights actually, a LOT of people wanted a Necromancer class. That was one of the most requested things whenever the topic came up.

Regardless, we have a Necromancer class now, we just need it to work properly.

Nordic__Knights

LukosCreyden wrote: »

@Nordic__Knights actually, a LOT of people wanted a Necromancer class. That was one of the most requested things whenever the topic came up.

Regardless, we have a Necromancer class now, we just need it to work properly.

Not going to have an back and forth with you on % of for class or for skill but as said they missed the mark making it an class and should revert it back and make it an skill line 100% sure more use of it would come this way then it is now

Maulkin

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

Artorias24 wrote: »

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

LukosCreyden wrote: »

@Nordic__Knights still makes zero sense. Besides, this is a thread for class balancing, not whatever that was.

As an skill line necromancer could had been something great as an class its an let down from all views
What i was showing was how within the game way before the add EVERY CLASS HAD TO USE NECROMANCY was told by 1 of the 5 Champion's he'd turn us into one but yet with all that they made it an unpleasant class no-one is happy with never has been really fell they missed out making it something it should never of been as necromancy is the art of dark magic not the dark class

Necromancer was one of the classes that everyone wanted since release and we dont need another skill line with only 5 skills, 1 ult and a few passives. While current classes already have problems to slot all needed skills.

So a class was the right choice.

No one wanted it to be an class yes everyone want skills or the use of necromancy but never had i seen anyone say make it an class when it was told everyone tried saying it be better as an skill and how much of the necromancer skills are use 5 maybe 6 and its ult even as an class so yes as an skill line it still be used and fun to know necromancy

You’re talking out of your arse. There were dozens of threads on this forum with polls about what the next class should be and Necro always topped it. And most people that post in this thread (me included) wanted a Necro class, that’s why they are playing one.

Besides this is a thread for the balance of the class not about doubting whether it should have existed. That’s done.

Artorias24

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

LukosCreyden wrote: »

@Nordic__Knights actually, a LOT of people wanted a Necromancer class. That was one of the most requested things whenever the topic came up.

Regardless, we have a Necromancer class now, we just need it to work properly.

Not going to have an back and forth with you on % of for class or for skill but as said they missed the mark making it an class and should revert it back and make it an skill line 100% sure more use of it would come this way then it is now

Actually no need to discuss this. They will never make necro just a skill line.

Ppl paid for the class, ppl created a char, some ppl only started with eso due to Necro class. So your point is kinda useless.

Nordic__Knights

Maulkin wrote: »

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

Artorias24 wrote: »

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

LukosCreyden wrote: »

@Nordic__Knights still makes zero sense. Besides, this is a thread for class balancing, not whatever that was.

As an skill line necromancer could had been something great as an class its an let down from all views
What i was showing was how within the game way before the add EVERY CLASS HAD TO USE NECROMANCY was told by 1 of the 5 Champion's he'd turn us into one but yet with all that they made it an unpleasant class no-one is happy with never has been really fell they missed out making it something it should never of been as necromancy is the art of dark magic not the dark class

Necromancer was one of the classes that everyone wanted since release and we dont need another skill line with only 5 skills, 1 ult and a few passives. While current classes already have problems to slot all needed skills.

So a class was the right choice.

No one wanted it to be an class yes everyone want skills or the use of necromancy but never had i seen anyone say make it an class when it was told everyone tried saying it be better as an skill and how much of the necromancer skills are use 5 maybe 6 and its ult even as an class so yes as an skill line it still be used and fun to know necromancy

You’re talking out of your arse. There were dozens of threads on this forum with polls about what the next class should be and Necro always topped it. And most people that post in this thread (me included) wanted a Necro class, that’s why they are playing one.

Besides this is a thread for the balance of the class not about doubting whether it should have existed. That’s done.

Your right about this being an feedback for necro my feedback is to revert it to an skill line imo ty

Nordic__Knights

Artorias24 wrote: »

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

LukosCreyden wrote: »

@Nordic__Knights actually, a LOT of people wanted a Necromancer class. That was one of the most requested things whenever the topic came up.

Regardless, we have a Necromancer class now, we just need it to work properly.

Not going to have an back and forth with you on % of for class or for skill but as said they missed the mark making it an class and should revert it back and make it an skill line 100% sure more use of it would come this way then it is now

Actually no need to discuss this. They will never make necro just a skill line.

Ppl paid for the class, ppl created a char, some ppl only started with eso due to Necro class. So your point is kinda useless.

ya but me feedback aint

LukosCreyden

Has there been any update on how the fix to Blast Bones is going? Pathing and whatnot.

Vicarra

I would gladly sacrifice major vulnerability on that one ulti if the regular class skills were brought up to the same standard (in terms of damage, reliability and synergy) as every other class. One of the defining points of the necro is/was that the ultis were far, far stronger than the class skills. As a result, if you want to DPS you have to use skills from the weapon lines over your class skills. No other class is in that situation.

The class needs more reliable CC, and it needs to really feel more like a necromancer. Instead of the blastbones, let us use corpses on the ground as CC. Essentially, any corpse can be zombified to "grasp" (perhaps as a torso) a nearby enemy within X metres by the ankles and slow them if they try to move for Y seconds - if they don't move, the torso explodes for disease damage. The more corpses, the more potential enemies can be grasped.

Skeletal mage needs to do more damage, but it should reward the use of other necro skills - the damage should be buffed by X percent, where X is the number of necromancy effects currently active, or the number of necro skills on the bar.

The spammable is very unsatisfying - in order for it to be preferable to destro skills like force pulse, remove the additional damage on the third cast, and give it a chance to apply some other effect instead. Aoe fear, aoe slow, or aoe resource drain, or aoe heal absorption etc.

Totem needs to fear immediately, not after an easily telegraphed 2-second delay. It's currently useless to everyone.

Stop upping the cost for boneyard if you keep nerfing the damage. Sustain is hard enough on a necro.

Let us use corpses as literal meat shields. Take away the major vulnerability of the colossus, but instead let us "pile" all nearby corpses into the colossus, and let 50% of incoming group damage be soaked up/diverted into the colossus for X seconds, where X is 3 seconds + the number of corpses consumed. Instead of having the tethers, which don't work AT ALL and are utterly useless, let us tether to one specific enemy and siphon their "life force" and convert it into a buff like minor vulnerability (for the damaging tethers).

ThePhantomThorn

Vicarra wrote: »

I would gladly sacrifice major vulnerability on that one ulti if the regular class skills were brought up to the same standard (in terms of damage, reliability and synergy) as every other class. One of the defining points of the necro is/was that the ultis were far, far stronger than the class skills. As a result, if you want to DPS you have to use skills from the weapon lines over your class skills. No other class is in that situation.

The class needs more reliable CC, and it needs to really feel more like a necromancer. Instead of the blastbones, let us use corpses on the ground as CC. Essentially, any corpse can be zombified to "grasp" (perhaps as a torso) a nearby enemy within X metres by the ankles and slow them if they try to move for Y seconds - if they don't move, the torso explodes for disease damage. The more corpses, the more potential enemies can be grasped.

Skeletal mage needs to do more damage, but it should reward the use of other necro skills - the damage should be buffed by X percent, where X is the number of necromancy effects currently active, or the number of necro skills on the bar.

The spammable is very unsatisfying - in order for it to be preferable to destro skills like force pulse, remove the additional damage on the third cast, and give it a chance to apply some other effect instead. Aoe fear, aoe slow, or aoe resource drain, or aoe heal absorption etc.

Totem needs to fear immediately, not after an easily telegraphed 2-second delay. It's currently useless to everyone.

Stop upping the cost for boneyard if you keep nerfing the damage. Sustain is hard enough on a necro.

Let us use corpses as literal meat shields. Take away the major vulnerability of the colossus, but instead let us "pile" all nearby corpses into the colossus, and let 50% of incoming group damage be soaked up/diverted into the colossus for X seconds, where X is 3 seconds + the number of corpses consumed. Instead of having the tethers, which don't work AT ALL and are utterly useless, let us tether to one specific enemy and siphon their "life force" and convert it into a buff like minor vulnerability (for the damaging tethers).

I just with blastbones would work.
But the rest of the ideas are awesome
And I’d just like to point out to all the necro haters, incap has a 20% damage increase and it costs 70 ult.
We need a better stun, stronger burst, and more necro feel

Nordic__Knights

ThePhantomThorn wrote: »

Vicarra wrote: »

I would gladly sacrifice major vulnerability on that one ulti if the regular class skills were brought up to the same standard (in terms of damage, reliability and synergy) as every other class. One of the defining points of the necro is/was that the ultis were far, far stronger than the class skills. As a result, if you want to DPS you have to use skills from the weapon lines over your class skills. No other class is in that situation.

The class needs more reliable CC, and it needs to really feel more like a necromancer. Instead of the blastbones, let us use corpses on the ground as CC. Essentially, any corpse can be zombified to "grasp" (perhaps as a torso) a nearby enemy within X metres by the ankles and slow them if they try to move for Y seconds - if they don't move, the torso explodes for disease damage. The more corpses, the more potential enemies can be grasped.

Skeletal mage needs to do more damage, but it should reward the use of other necro skills - the damage should be buffed by X percent, where X is the number of necromancy effects currently active, or the number of necro skills on the bar.

The spammable is very unsatisfying - in order for it to be preferable to destro skills like force pulse, remove the additional damage on the third cast, and give it a chance to apply some other effect instead. Aoe fear, aoe slow, or aoe resource drain, or aoe heal absorption etc.

Totem needs to fear immediately, not after an easily telegraphed 2-second delay. It's currently useless to everyone.

Stop upping the cost for boneyard if you keep nerfing the damage. Sustain is hard enough on a necro.

Let us use corpses as literal meat shields. Take away the major vulnerability of the colossus, but instead let us "pile" all nearby corpses into the colossus, and let 50% of incoming group damage be soaked up/diverted into the colossus for X seconds, where X is 3 seconds + the number of corpses consumed. Instead of having the tethers, which don't work AT ALL and are utterly useless, let us tether to one specific enemy and siphon their "life force" and convert it into a buff like minor vulnerability (for the damaging tethers).

I just with blastbones would work.
But the rest of the ideas are awesome
And I’d just like to point out to all the necro haters, incap has a 20% damage increase and it costs 70 ult.
We need a better stun, stronger burst, and more necro feel

And has cast time with small hit box making it one of the easy ults to dodge

ThePhantomThorn

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

ThePhantomThorn wrote: »

Vicarra wrote: »

I would gladly sacrifice major vulnerability on that one ulti if the regular class skills were brought up to the same standard (in terms of damage, reliability and synergy) as every other class. One of the defining points of the necro is/was that the ultis were far, far stronger than the class skills. As a result, if you want to DPS you have to use skills from the weapon lines over your class skills. No other class is in that situation.

The class needs more reliable CC, and it needs to really feel more like a necromancer. Instead of the blastbones, let us use corpses on the ground as CC. Essentially, any corpse can be zombified to "grasp" (perhaps as a torso) a nearby enemy within X metres by the ankles and slow them if they try to move for Y seconds - if they don't move, the torso explodes for disease damage. The more corpses, the more potential enemies can be grasped.

Skeletal mage needs to do more damage, but it should reward the use of other necro skills - the damage should be buffed by X percent, where X is the number of necromancy effects currently active, or the number of necro skills on the bar.

The spammable is very unsatisfying - in order for it to be preferable to destro skills like force pulse, remove the additional damage on the third cast, and give it a chance to apply some other effect instead. Aoe fear, aoe slow, or aoe resource drain, or aoe heal absorption etc.

Totem needs to fear immediately, not after an easily telegraphed 2-second delay. It's currently useless to everyone.

Stop upping the cost for boneyard if you keep nerfing the damage. Sustain is hard enough on a necro.

Let us use corpses as literal meat shields. Take away the major vulnerability of the colossus, but instead let us "pile" all nearby corpses into the colossus, and let 50% of incoming group damage be soaked up/diverted into the colossus for X seconds, where X is 3 seconds + the number of corpses consumed. Instead of having the tethers, which don't work AT ALL and are utterly useless, let us tether to one specific enemy and siphon their "life force" and convert it into a buff like minor vulnerability (for the damaging tethers).

I just with blastbones would work.
But the rest of the ideas are awesome
And I’d just like to point out to all the necro haters, incap has a 20% damage increase and it costs 70 ult.
We need a better stun, stronger burst, and more necro feel

And has cast time with small hit box making it one of the easy ults to dodge

Easy to dodge...
Have you ever used colossus ult?
Big obvious aoe. Usually escaped before 2nd hit. AND costs 220.
Just making a point, not starting an argument like the one above.
Just let it go

pharlex

Y

Vicarra wrote: »

I would gladly sacrifice major vulnerability on that one ulti if the regular class skills were brought up to the same standard (in terms of damage, reliability and synergy) as every other class. One of the defining points of the necro is/was that the ultis were far, far stronger than the class skills. As a result, if you want to DPS you have to use skills from the weapon lines over your class skills. No other class is in that situation.

The class needs more reliable CC, and it needs to really feel more like a necromancer. Instead of the blastbones, let us use corpses on the ground as CC. Essentially, any corpse can be zombified to "grasp" (perhaps as a torso) a nearby enemy within X metres by the ankles and slow them if they try to move for Y seconds - if they don't move, the torso explodes for disease damage. The more corpses, the more potential enemies can be grasped.

Skeletal mage needs to do more damage, but it should reward the use of other necro skills - the damage should be buffed by X percent, where X is the number of necromancy effects currently active, or the number of necro skills on the bar.

The spammable is very unsatisfying - in order for it to be preferable to destro skills like force pulse, remove the additional damage on the third cast, and give it a chance to apply some other effect instead. Aoe fear, aoe slow, or aoe resource drain, or aoe heal absorption etc.

Totem needs to fear immediately, not after an easily telegraphed 2-second delay. It's currently useless to everyone.

Stop upping the cost for boneyard if you keep nerfing the damage. Sustain is hard enough on a necro.

Let us use corpses as literal meat shields. Take away the major vulnerability of the colossus, but instead let us "pile" all nearby corpses into the colossus, and let 50% of incoming group damage be soaked up/diverted into the colossus for X seconds, where X is 3 seconds + the number of corpses consumed. Instead of having the tethers, which don't work AT ALL and are utterly useless, let us tether to one specific enemy and siphon their "life force" and convert it into a buff like minor vulnerability (for the damaging tethers).

With all that extra corpse usage youre going to need some way to produce corpses other than the current ways, they are too slow for being useful in those ways and for pvp there really isnt going to be enough corpses for that either.

Also the tethers work fine really the main problem is having to aim for the corpses you generate from the abilities we do have which means either blast bones which doesnt work right all the time or summons which usually drop their corpses underneath you or to the sides of you meaning you have to stop focusing on the currect combat to then turn and aim at a corpses for your tether before you can resume focusing on combat again, hence why my suggestions involve having other abilities that will spawn corpses in front of the player rather than their current awkward placement that only works really well for one of their abilities that doesnt require aiming at them.

Im all for dropping major vuln for more effects and corpse usage but minor vuln on a tether kind of makes the bone totem synergy morph useless.

katorga

FWIW, skeletal mage damage should not be scaled according to the AOE dot standard.

1. It is not a DOT. It is a direct damage ability that casts every 2 seconds, and can CHANGE targets. It is closer to Flames of Oblivion than a DOT.
2. The skill does not put a status effect on the target, cannot be purged, and can be LOS.
3. The un-morphed version and the stam version have zero AOE component, yet they are applying the AOE dot standard

The same reasoning applies to the mender pet. It is not a hot. It is a single target heal that casts every 2 seconds on potentially different targets.

Oh, and fix BlastBones.

Stibbons

Coprses should bodyblock damage on that direction or undead pets attleast. Necromancer only.

TheDarkShadow

Since Warden's Swarm got 10s Minor Vulnerability now, should we buff Necro's totem to match it? The totem currently gives 5s Minor Vul.

Ariades_swe

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

LukosCreyden wrote: »

@Nordic__Knights actually, a LOT of people wanted a Necromancer class. That was one of the most requested things whenever the topic came up.

Regardless, we have a Necromancer class now, we just need it to work properly.

Not going to have an back and forth with you on % of for class or for skill but as said they missed the mark making it an class and should revert it back and make it an skill line 100% sure more use of it would come this way then it is now

...

Ariades_swe

katorga wrote: »

FWIW, skeletal mage damage should not be scaled according to the AOE dot standard.

1. It is not a DOT. It is a direct damage ability that casts every 2 seconds, and can CHANGE targets. It is closer to Flames of Oblivion than a DOT.
2. The skill does not put a status effect on the target, cannot be purged, and can be LOS.
3. The un-morphed version and the stam version have zero AOE component, yet they are applying the AOE dot standard

The same reasoning applies to the mender pet. It is not a hot. It is a single target heal that casts every 2 seconds on potentially different targets.

Oh, and fix BlastBones.

So it scales of thaumaturge?

Maulkin

katorga wrote: »

FWIW, skeletal mage damage should not be scaled according to the AOE dot standard.

1. It is not a DOT. It is a direct damage ability that casts every 2 seconds, and can CHANGE targets. It is closer to Flames of Oblivion than a DOT.
2. The skill does not put a status effect on the target, cannot be purged, and can be LOS.
3. The un-morphed version and the stam version have zero AOE component, yet they are applying the AOE dot standard

The same reasoning applies to the mender pet. It is not a hot. It is a single target heal that casts every 2 seconds on potentially different targets.

Oh, and fix BlastBones.

As far as I know it's not a DoT, it scales with Master-At-Arms not Thaumaturge like FoO that you mentioned. So why they would apply DoT standards to it, when they didn''t to FoO is beyond me.

And while it currently does more total damage than FoO on same build, the latter gives Major Prophecy & Major Savagery while snaring opponents by 30% (Warmth Passive). When the current DoT nerfs come through, Skeletal Arcanist will do less damage than FoO while providing absolutely no buffs or debuffs.

ZOS Logic.

cheifsoap

Has anyone done any parses since 5.2.3 and wouldn't mind sharing them with me?