Guild Summit?

ZOS_JessicaFolsom · October 2014

KriHavok wrote: »

Is it possible for this summit to be livestreamed/recorded, either by ZoS or the guilds?

Due to some technical limitations, we won’t be able to live stream the summit. That said, we do intended to be very open about what is discussed, any new info that comes out of the summit, and will even cover as much of it as we can in our next episode of ESO Live.

We’d also like to thank those of you who have made other constructive suggestions in this thread. As we've said already, we are constantly working on new and improved ways of communicating with you all, and your feedback is super helpful. The Guild Summit, as well as ESO Live and other things you've seen pop up lately, are all a part of this effort, and we look forward to improving these existing programs and developing new ones with your thoughtful suggestions.

One thing we would like to call out, specifically, is that we are working on ways to address many of your PvP-centric concerns. While the Guild Summit will contain a discussion about the state and future of PvP in ESO, we are also working on putting together other ways, such as a live Q&A, to answer your questions and respond to your feedback.

Pmarsico9 · October 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Pmarsico9 wrote: »

Anything about Class and Skill Line balancing?

Yes, there will be discussions about that as well, and we'll be happy to provide notes to everyone regarding what was discussed and any new info that comes out of the summit.

It's good to hear this, but it would still be much more beneficial to have a somewhat more open dialogue or outline of perceived issues and allow us all to provide some feedback. People wouldn't complain so loudly if they didn't care, so while I appreciate that various topics will be discussed, I still don't fully understand why it's 20 guilds that were hand picked instead of maybe tossing some replies with some sort of design intent vision from time to time, at least regarding balance and class design issues.

Vendersleigh · October 2014

I hope that RP issues will be discussed at the summit. Perhaps one or more of the 20 can volunteer to raise them?

polar · October 2014

They actually fixed this part. As of patch 1.4, you can accompany & help out your party members no matter which part of the quest you or they are on. (Atleast in Craglorn).[/quote]

I do not believe that this is correct. I have been unable to help friends complete Celestial Investigator as recently as this last weekend. I can help them right up to going in the door to fight the boss of each quest step and I am blocked from helping there. Further, to complete the last quest in the sequence, you need 4 players that are all on that last quest to complete.

Put differently, it is still FUBAR and they need to give it some attention.

ZOS_GinaBruno · October 2014

Just a heads up that in addition to the article we'll be posting next week, Tamriel Foundry is currently doing live updates right from the Guild Summit. You can check out all the information as it gets published, here: http://tamrielfoundry.com/2014/10/eso-guild-summit/

dcincali · October 2014

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Just a heads up that in addition to the article we'll be posting next week, Tamriel Foundry is currently doing live updates right from the Guild Summit. You can check out all the information as it gets published, here: http://tamrielfoundry.com/2014/10/eso-guild-summit/

Reading on that update I haven't found anything that hasn't already been brought up here on the forums, in a road ahead article or posted from a dev I've found in the tracker. It's filled with fluff and "coming soon", the only difference is you invited 20 people to talk about it. Hopefully by the end there will be something worth reading.

Pmarsico9 · October 2014

The role of animation canceling:

Animation and attack priority is currently driven by gameplay mechanics, and animation design is created to support the gameplay features. Animation cancelling with macro usage is “cheating”, but the way that attacks currently interact is intended, but will hopefully be improved in the future.

Animation cancelling is stupid and needs dragged out back and shot. To say the bolded really, really sucks. Really non-committal comment of nothingness overall regarding something that should be considered an exploit.

Desdemonte · October 2014

Pmarsico9 wrote: »

The role of animation canceling:

Animation and attack priority is currently driven by gameplay mechanics, and animation design is created to support the gameplay features. Animation cancelling with macro usage is “cheating”, but the way that attacks currently interact is intended, but will hopefully be improved in the future.

Animation cancelling is stupid and needs dragged out back and shot. To say the bolded really, really sucks. Really non-committal comment of nothingness overall regarding something that should be considered an exploit.

Sounds like a bunch of gobbledygook that they are trying to use to confuse the issue. If it's intended, and macros are so easy to make for games, and macro ing it is cheating..... WTF is that supposed to mean?

Initial reports are not very confidence inspiring.

Desdemonte · October 2014

Quoted from Atropos' overview:

"Q: Exploitation, emperor farming, lag, disconnects, and crashes in Cyrodiil have frustrated a lot of players into quitting the game. How are you working to address these issues and handle them quickly as they emerge in the future?

A: A lot of time when we (ZOS) see those behaviors they try to take private (not public) action to correct them. Hopefully improved channels of communication with player groups can help identify these problems faster in the future."

Well, there it is folks. Proof that this whole summit is pure BS. My confidence is plummeting

DDuke · October 2014

Oh and it gets worse...

Player motivation for participating in the Imperial City vs. Cyrodiil proper? What rewards are there for players? What about alliance ranks after 24?

"They are looking into expanding the alliance skill lines to include additional abilities as well as possible alliance rank dependent tiers of gear, but there is some concern that this approach would be too elitist favoring hardcore PvPers too much."

How on earth are they going to implement the "seasonal gear" they promised, if they're too afraid to give PvPers some of it? Ridiculous...

Razzak · October 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Cuyler wrote: »

I think a lot of the guildies here want to know the criteria for your selection process. Only having 20 openings would mean that you've got to be picking only the best of the best...so maybe give us some info on what we should be striving too so as to be considered in the future?

Edit: If it's not supposed to be secret, why is it shrouded in so much mystery? I play everyday and on the forums everyday. I have not seen a promotion, a list a winners, or anything but a single post via one of the winners after they had already been choosen.

If not meant to be a secret, ZOS sure fooled me 8(

Rest assured, we selected guild representatives carefully to ensure a wide range of player interests would be represented. We want to say again that this summit isn’t just to get the thoughts and opinions of the individuals attending and the guilds they’re representing (though we are certainly looking forward to our discussions and hearing their feedback). It is also about community building and showcasing some of our upcoming content to let players (including folks who will read the round-up) know about some of the great stuff we have coming.

This summit is not meant to be shrouded in mystery. On the contrary, we’re excited to have the folks in attendance share as much as they can with you all! We’re encouraging attendees to come back to you all with their thoughts and findings, and the round-up next week will cover much of what we discussed. Additionally, after reading your feedback in this and several other threads, we would like to give you a quick glimpse of topics we’ll be showcasing and discussing during the summit:
Crafting

Grouping/Phasing

PvP

Combat Responsiveness

Champion System

Justice System

Please stop using words "your" and "representatives" in the same sentence. Because they are definitely not that. They are, at best, part of YOUR players base, selected by some secret selection process. They definitely have nothing to do with me or many others here. I don't even know who they are, how they got selected, what their virtues are, how good they are at discussion or giving feedback, ... unless, of course, you know all of them from before, which would explain a lot.
A group of 20 is not and can not be a represeantation of your players base. A group of 200 is not large enough to be that. It's unclear if you are deliberately ingoring this fact or simply using it to your advantage : "We’re encouraging attendees to come back to you all with their thoughts and findings, and the round-up next week will cover much of what we discussed."
What are they supposed to do after they come back? Replace your CS dept?

In this, one thread, we've had more official feedback per post then probably in any other thread so far. And its a thread about a [snip] summit . Is it because it's the only thing you feel comfortable talking to us?
Why?

Is it a new way of outsourcing? A cheapest way to later say "Well your representatives (I shudder just typing that) didn't mention anything about that on the summit".

What exactly do you think you will achieve with this summit as opposed to using this forum for communication?

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

WebBull · October 2014

ZOS has to balance making players stronger with providing an ample challenge to players. This means a complete re-balance of game and ability mechanics is necessary. Current granularity of stats does not fit well with the addition of small percentage bonuses. Adding a 1% bonus on top of a base level of 40 isn’t meaningful to the player. Simply adding points to soft-capped abilities would be bad.

Benefits of the Current Systems

Helps to prevent “bad builds”
Freedom of how to play – allows players to go over limits

Problems with the Current System

Trade-offs are not pronounced
Too easy to hit soft caps
Balance is harder

Solutions:

All your character’s stats, attributes, and damage values will be multiplied by 10 (for example, a Health of 2,500 would become a Health of 25,000). This will allow small percentage bonuses to realize a visible impact on your character’s stat lines.
Soft caps are being removed entirely.
Impose some limits – for example, Armor (Physical resistance) caps out at 50% mitigation. On live right now, this would equate to roughly 3,000 armor.
Once these changes are in place, the numbers in abilities, items, enchantments, weapons, etc… will all need to be changed.

It makes it seem like there was ZERO forethought to player progression beyond 50 until......well.......now (post release).

LonePirate · October 2014

Razzak wrote: »

Please stop using words "your" and "representatives" in the same sentence. Because they are definitely not that. They are, at best, part of YOUR players base, selected by some secret selection process. They definitely have nothing to do with me or many others here. I don't even know who they are, how they got selected, what their virtues are, how good they are at discussion or giving feedback, ... unless, of course, you know all of them from before, which would explain a lot.

Most of the invitees represent guilds that have been involved in Beta testing of the game since spring/summer of 2013. Basically, ZOS did know all of these guilds from before.

Desdemonte · October 2014

Quoted:

Q: What kind of challenges will this system involve for educating players on where their stats are coming from and helping them understand how the new system works without having to show them a PowerPoint presentation?

A: The reality is that most players don’t really care too much, and they simply trust that their stats are adding naturally. This will actually be a fairly natural system since the caps in place prevent you from ever getting “too much” of a certain stat.

Seriously? OMFG.

*I* care! I'm sure *many* people care! We want to understand the mechanics so we can maximize a build. Why do you think we hate your [snip] tool tips?!?

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

Tabbycat · October 2014

LonePirate wrote: »

Razzak wrote: »

Please stop using words "your" and "representatives" in the same sentence. Because they are definitely not that. They are, at best, part of YOUR players base, selected by some secret selection process. They definitely have nothing to do with me or many others here. I don't even know who they are, how they got selected, what their virtues are, how good they are at discussion or giving feedback, ... unless, of course, you know all of them from before, which would explain a lot.

Most of the invitees represent guilds that have been involved in Beta testing of the game since spring/summer of 2013. Basically, ZOS did know all of these guilds from before.

Could be. I don't really know. The first time I heard about this was when someone in my guild asked if I knew if anyone in our guild had been invited.

I honestly don't care who was invited as long as ZOS does begin to address some of the more serious concerns that have been brought up since beta.

There is a gap between what ZOS thinks their player base wants and what their players actually do want.

lumithelock · October 2014

Tamriel Unchained will be starting live at 10:30est http://www.gamebreaker.tv/live/ GAMEBREAKER NATIONS offical ESO podcast we will have info about the new champions system

Tyr · October 2014

DDuke wrote: »

Oh and it gets worse...

Player motivation for participating in the Imperial City vs. Cyrodiil proper? What rewards are there for players? What about alliance ranks after 24?

"They are looking into expanding the alliance skill lines to include additional abilities as well as possible alliance rank dependent tiers of gear, but there is some concern that this approach would be too elitist favoring hardcore PvPers too much."

How on earth are they going to implement the "seasonal gear" they promised, if they're too afraid to give PvPers some of it? Ridiculous...

Desdemonte wrote: »

Quoted:

Q: What kind of challenges will this system involve for educating players on where their stats are coming from and helping them understand how the new system works without having to show them a PowerPoint presentation?

A: The reality is that most players don’t really care too much, and they simply trust that their stats are adding naturally. This will actually be a fairly natural system since the caps in place prevent you from ever getting “too much” of a certain stat.

Seriously? OMFG.

*I* care! I'm sure *many* people care! We want to understand the mechanics so we can maximize a build. Why do you think we hate your shite tool tips?!?

They are telling you that they want your efforts in trying to maximize a build to be less important and you choosing the build you like to play and grouping with others with complementary builds to be more important in maximizing your performance.

Tyr · October 2014

WebBull wrote: »

ZOS has to balance making players stronger with providing an ample challenge to players. This means a complete re-balance of game and ability mechanics is necessary. Current granularity of stats does not fit well with the addition of small percentage bonuses. Adding a 1% bonus on top of a base level of 40 isn’t meaningful to the player. Simply adding points to soft-capped abilities would be bad.

Benefits of the Current Systems

Helps to prevent “bad builds”
Freedom of how to play – allows players to go over limits

Problems with the Current System

Trade-offs are not pronounced
Too easy to hit soft caps
Balance is harder

Solutions:

All your character’s stats, attributes, and damage values will be multiplied by 10 (for example, a Health of 2,500 would become a Health of 25,000). This will allow small percentage bonuses to realize a visible impact on your character’s stat lines.
Soft caps are being removed entirely.
Impose some limits – for example, Armor (Physical resistance) caps out at 50% mitigation. On live right now, this would equate to roughly 3,000 armor.
Once these changes are in place, the numbers in abilities, items, enchantments, weapons, etc… will all need to be changed.

It makes it seem like there was ZERO forethought to player progression beyond 50 until......well.......now (post release).

There was 6 years of development for level 50 and less than 1 year for vet levels because people were screaming about having to roll alts to experience other alliances.

ZOS is now building in a compromise with the champ system and letting people play how they want post 50.

Gilvoth · October 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

KriHavok wrote: »

Is it possible for this summit to be livestreamed/recorded, either by ZoS or the guilds?

Due to some technical limitations, we won’t be able to live stream the summit. That said, we do intended to be very open about what is discussed, any new info that comes out of the summit, and will even cover as much of it as we can in our next episode of ESO Live.

We’d also like to thank those of you who have made other constructive suggestions in this thread. As we've said already, we are constantly working on new and improved ways of communicating with you all, and your feedback is super helpful. The Guild Summit, as well as ESO Live and other things you've seen pop up lately, are all a part of this effort, and we look forward to improving these existing programs and developing new ones with your thoughtful suggestions.

One thing we would like to call out, specifically, is that we are working on ways to address many of your PvP-centric concerns. While the Guild Summit will contain a discussion about the state and future of PvP in ESO, we are also working on putting together other ways, such as a live Q&A, to answer your questions and respond to your feedback.

i am very impressed with what i just read on what was said and i read from the copy paste on this link ->http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/comment/1300559/#Comment_1300559
i am going to trust you guys on your words and looking forward definately to seeing what does come out in update 1.5.0 especialy the part where paul sage said

-Paul Sage
quote:

"ZOS has to balance making players stronger with providing an ample challenge to players. This means a complete re-balance of game and ability mechanics is necessary."

end quote:

my responce:
that to me is a very serious statement, and looks like a very strong commitment and very determined team work oriented stance.
very impresive and thank you mr. sage for the honesty in admiting that there was and is an imbalance in the classes.
i am going to hold you to your words on this and wait to see the results very closely.
as a nightblade, this means a great deal to me and my class as a duel wield.

zazamalek · October 2014

@ZOS_GinaBruno‌ The problem with talking to the "top PvP guilds" is that they are "top guilds" because they all <Impulse> train, it's the best way to hit the top spots at the moment. I doesn't surprise me at all that these zerg trains weren't bought up by them.

PvE is a different story, but as far as PvP goes you really need to get more inclusive feedback. At this rate the balance of power will swing even further to those guilds willing to spam 1 key all night long. Oh well. Thanks for the effort, though. It's a step in the right direction, just keep in mind that you have taken a very specific slice of the community.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO · October 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

KriHavok wrote: »

Is it possible for this summit to be livestreamed/recorded, either by ZoS or the guilds?

Due to some technical limitations, we won’t be able to live stream the summit.

How convenient for you.

R1ckyDaMan · October 2014

Desdemonte wrote: »

Quoted:

Q: What kind of challenges will this system involve for educating players on where their stats are coming from and helping them understand how the new system works without having to show them a PowerPoint presentation?

A: The reality is that most players don’t really care too much, and they simply trust that their stats are adding naturally. This will actually be a fairly natural system since the caps in place prevent you from ever getting “too much” of a certain stat.

Seriously? OMFG.

*I* care! I'm sure *many* people care! We want to understand the mechanics so we can maximize a build. Why do you think we hate your shite tool tips?!?

Horses mouth though, most don't, get over it.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO · October 2014

Razzak wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Cuyler wrote: »

I think a lot of the guildies here want to know the criteria for your selection process. Only having 20 openings would mean that you've got to be picking only the best of the best...so maybe give us some info on what we should be striving too so as to be considered in the future?

Edit: If it's not supposed to be secret, why is it shrouded in so much mystery? I play everyday and on the forums everyday. I have not seen a promotion, a list a winners, or anything but a single post via one of the winners after they had already been choosen.

If not meant to be a secret, ZOS sure fooled me 8(

Rest assured, we selected guild representatives carefully to ensure a wide range of player interests would be represented. We want to say again that this summit isn’t just to get the thoughts and opinions of the individuals attending and the guilds they’re representing (though we are certainly looking forward to our discussions and hearing their feedback). It is also about community building and showcasing some of our upcoming content to let players (including folks who will read the round-up) know about some of the great stuff we have coming.

This summit is not meant to be shrouded in mystery. On the contrary, we’re excited to have the folks in attendance share as much as they can with you all! We’re encouraging attendees to come back to you all with their thoughts and findings, and the round-up next week will cover much of what we discussed. Additionally, after reading your feedback in this and several other threads, we would like to give you a quick glimpse of topics we’ll be showcasing and discussing during the summit:
Crafting

Grouping/Phasing

PvP

Combat Responsiveness

Champion System

Justice System

Please stop using words "your" and "representatives" in the same sentence.

She didn't, stop misstating what she wrote, the word representatives appears in one sentence only, as bolded, the word your isn't in that sentence.

Probitas · October 2014

Closed meetings should always be watched closely. The problem is that we will never know. I can suspect that this is why the game does not have an auction hall, since right now this benefits the guilds hugely and arses players not in the guild.

Likely questions like " how can we keep your guild from quitting' etc.

Tabbycat · October 2014

I am glad that ZOS realizes that we love the 1-50 leveling experience and that they know they need to make the post 50 experience just as rewarding.

The majority of players that quit do so because:

Post 50 content is unrewording in terms of challenge and lack of rewards for effort.

ZOS, people enjoy your dungeons. People won't run them because they feel they aren't being rewarded for their effort. 2 gold for killing a Veteran Boss is ridiculous.

I know you all are working on it, but in the mean time your vet players are getting restless. It's time to throw them a bone. Bump up the rewards before the next major content update. Everyone who told you we had too much gold during beta was wrong. I kept saying then as I will say now, people will not do the content, no matter how fun it is, if they aren't being rewarded for it.

pppontus · October 2014

Tabbycat wrote: »

I am glad that ZOS realizes that we love the 1-50 leveling experience and that they know they need to make the post 50 experience just as rewarding.

The majority of players that quit do so because:

Post 50 content is unrewording in terms of challenge and lack of rewards for effort.

ZOS, people enjoy your dungeons. People won't run them because they feel they aren't being rewarded for their effort. 2 gold for killing a Veteran Boss is ridiculous.

I know you all are working on it, but in the mean time your vet players are getting restless. It's time to throw them a bone. Bump up the rewards before the next major content update. Everyone who told you we had too much gold during beta was wrong. I kept saying then as I will say now, people will not do the content, no matter how fun it is, if they aren't being rewarded for it.

I think the problem with gold rewards is that more gold just means everyone has more gold and the price of items will just rise, so there's no real point in it other than it being a bigger number. I 100% agree with rewards though, although I'm hoping for dungeon scaling to fix that a little and Update 4 actually snuck in a few itemization niceities such as really good weekly trial rewards, and additional set item loot in Vet CoH. They just need more of that + dungeon scaling and I think the itemization is back on track

Cuyler · October 2014

Thudunblundur wrote: »

There is no selection procedure that could have made everyone happy. Frankly I'm glad they are doing this and hope it may do some good. I'm sure those going appreciate they are representing all of us and being guild leaders should have some idea of the concerns of their guildmates.

Mostly though I suspect that the reps will be shown round the departments and the work that is going on to demonstrate that Zenimax etc are doing their damnedest to get everything sorted. If they can help solve any of the issues that exist that would be great.

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Cuyler wrote: »

I think a lot of the guildies here want to know the criteria for your selection process. Only having 20 openings would mean that you've got to be picking only the best of the best...so maybe give us some info on what we should be striving too so as to be considered in the future?

Edit: If it's not supposed to be secret, why is it shrouded in so much mystery? I play everyday and on the forums everyday. I have not seen a promotion, a list a winners, or anything but a single post via one of the winners after they had already been choosen.

If not meant to be a secret, ZOS sure fooled me 8(

Rest assured, we selected guild representatives carefully to ensure a wide range of player interests would be represented. We want to say again that this summit isn’t just to get the thoughts and opinions of the individuals attending and the guilds they’re representing (though we are certainly looking forward to our discussions and hearing their feedback). It is also about community building and showcasing some of our upcoming content to let players (including folks who will read the round-up) know about some of the great stuff we have coming.

This summit is not meant to be shrouded in mystery. On the contrary, we’re excited to have the folks in attendance share as much as they can with you all! We’re encouraging attendees to come back to you all with their thoughts and findings, and the round-up next week will cover much of what we discussed. Additionally, after reading your feedback in this and several other threads, we would like to give you a quick glimpse of topics we’ll be showcasing and discussing during the summit:
Crafting

Grouping/Phasing

PvP

Combat Responsiveness

Champion System

Justice System

Thanks for the info @ZOS_JessicaFolsom! 8)

I guess I just expected to see a guild summit press release in the news shown on the eso launcher before hearing about it on the forums. Was there any info regarding the summit posted on the launcher? maybe I just missed it?

If not, it wouldn't be a bad idea to let everyone know about it there as well.

Razzak · October 2014

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

She didn't, stop misstating what she wrote, the word representatives appears in one sentence only, as bolded, the word your isn't in that sentence.

I stand corrected.

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

...

As we've said already, we are constantly working on new and improved ways of communicating with you all, and your feedback is super helpful.

...

If this summit is the sole result of this work I can only say: work harder. Instead of using this, your own forum, whose basic concept is exactly that, a communication, you are inventing new and definitely not useful ways of doing that.
It's really mind boggling why you are so active in ignoring the chance to communicate to us.
So far, the only result of this summit is slightly different Q&A on another site (Tamriel foundry). Is this the real reason for the summit? To slowly divert communication with players to others?

If you want to communicate "with us all", then do just that. Communicate to us all, not via proxy. After all, if our feedback is "super helpful" why is your communication so appalling?

fromtesonlineb16_ESO · October 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Cuyler wrote: »

I think a lot of the guildies here want to know the criteria for your selection process. Only having 20 openings would mean that you've got to be picking only the best of the best...so maybe give us some info on what we should be striving too so as to be considered in the future?

Edit: If it's not supposed to be secret, why is it shrouded in so much mystery? I play everyday and on the forums everyday. I have not seen a promotion, a list a winners, or anything but a single post via one of the winners after they had already been choosen.

If not meant to be a secret, ZOS sure fooled me 8(

Rest assured, we selected guild representatives carefully to ensure a wide range of player interests would be represented

Which immediately excludes all those who aren't in guilds out of choice or necessity, and whose views it seems ZOS couldn't care a toss about.

Right?

fromtesonlineb16_ESO · October 2014

At least when Turbine set up their 'player council' in LOTRO they had the decency to make it democratic and had players nominate and then vote for those who the developer would discuss the game with .. the players chose the representatives to attend these shindigs, while in ESO ZOS get to choose whose voices they listen to.

The elected reps. then solicited input from their 'constituents', who at least knew their concerns would be raised .. here there's no such canvassing of comments, the chosen few are free to discuss their pet projects alone .. I assume Entropy Rising are there, for example.