So how does VR armor work without VR?

Pallmor

Haven't really heard much about this topic and thought I would bring it up. Has anyone heard anything about how armor is going to work under the Champion System, without the VR ranks? Improved armor was one of the hallmarks of the VR system, and now that the system is going, I'm curious as to what will become of our VR1-VR14 armors.

Is all VR armor going to revert to level 50 armor? I'm pretty sure that wouldn't make the people with legendary VR14 armor happy.

Are we going to be able to keep our existing VR armor, but can't make any more? That wouldn't be fair since people with VR14 armor would then have a permanent advantage over everyone else.

Is it going to be tied to XP instead of VR ranks? For example, you would need 14 million XP over level 50 to craft the equivalent of VR14 armor.

Is it going to be tied to some new talent line?

Thechemicals

Do we have word for word proof showing that veteran rank is being removed? I thought champion system was an addition to veterancy. I am not certain how they are going to implement this but im guessing poorly from experience.

TehMagnus

Thechemicals wrote: »

Do we have word for word proof showing that veteran rank is being removed? I thought champion system was an addition to veterancy. I am not certain how they are going to implement this but im guessing poorly from experience.

I highly doubt we will all be level 50 nor that the armor sets will be reverted although that might come with seasonal armor depending how they implement it.

Maybe "Veteran Ranks" will become "Champion Level" and thus the cap will be greatly increased

Kolache

this reference was found in: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/122386/general-confusion-about-veteran-rank-and-champion-system

ZOS_MariaAliprando wrote: »

What happens to the Veteran Ranks we currently have VR1-12?

We want to remove the Veteran Ranks from the game and rely on the more active progression provided by the Champion System. However, when we release the Champion System we will continue to maintain Veteran Ranks. We have several options as to how we will remove Veteran Ranks but all of them require time and careful planning.

I really don't see how this can't eventually result in a much flatter progression model at level cap when it's fully implemented, (which I think would be awesome), but I guess we'll just see

Thechemicals

Kolache wrote: »

this reference was found in: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/122386/general-confusion-about-veteran-rank-and-champion-system

ZOS_MariaAliprando wrote: »

What happens to the Veteran Ranks we currently have VR1-12?

We want to remove the Veteran Ranks from the game and rely on the more active progression provided by the Champion System. However, when we release the Champion System we will continue to maintain Veteran Ranks. We have several options as to how we will remove Veteran Ranks but all of them require time and careful planning.

I really don't see how this can't eventually result in a much flatter progression model at level cap when it's fully implemented, (which I think would be awesome), but I guess we'll just see

So they will not remove the veteran rank when champion system is released. This seems like a further down the road thing. Champion is not replacing vr for now.

Pallmor

I think there is some confusion here. It was my understanding that Phase 3 of the implementation of the Champion System did indeed involve complete removal of Veteran Ranks. Presumably, this is what's coming with Update 6.

TehMagnus

I hope we don't get linear (horizontal progression) at cap. There's Guild Wars for that .

Bouvin

Pallmor wrote: »

I think there is some confusion here. It was my understanding that Phase 3 of the implementation of the Champion System did indeed involve complete removal of Veteran Ranks. Presumably, this is what's coming with Update 6.

I think phase 3 has turned to phase 2.5....

murmur

If I have understood it right, when Veteran levels will be removed also seasonal gear will be introduced. With this old VR14 gear will be "last season" gear that we will be replacing with new "current season" gear.

Rosveen

Removal of veteran ranks comes in phase 4. Patch 1.6 is phase 3. Seasonal gear should also come as part of phase 4, but who knows what changed since they announced their plans.

Kolache

magnusnet wrote: »

I hope we don't get linear (horizontal progression) at cap. There's Guild Wars for that .

IMO, moderation is the best answer for a lot of things, including MMO progression

Shooting from the hip with a prediction, I'd imagine they're just aiming for more sustainable systems that can more accurately be measured and balanced, (unlike the current periodic level cap increase and extremely flexible stat system).

I'm sort of thinking that their mention of animation tweaking will also involve balancing animation cancelling. Not removing necessarily, just formally accounting for it/designing around it one way or another.

I may be overly optimistic, but in the end I don't think one side has to win and the other has to lose--they just need some more concrete foundations in the game to build on.

Potenza

murmur wrote: »

If I have understood it right, when Veteran levels will be removed also seasonal gear will be introduced. With this old VR14 gear will be "last season" gear that we will be replacing with new "current season" gear.

If and when seasonal gear arrives - Im outa here - not going back to the "grind for gear" gaming I left at wow.

Kolache

j.murro2ub17_ESO wrote: »

murmur wrote: »

If I have understood it right, when Veteran levels will be removed also seasonal gear will be introduced. With this old VR14 gear will be "last season" gear that we will be replacing with new "current season" gear.

If and when seasonal gear arrives - Im outa here - not going back to the "grind for gear" gaming I left at wow.

I don't like endless treadmills either, but if anything I figured the new season system would be less grindy than the current system. As it is, they could just release new VRs periodically to prolong the grind. With the new season system they make it sound like getting the previous season's gear will be somewhat trivial... so bleeding edge gear acquisition would stay the same, but a very competitive level would be much easier to obtain/refresh. That's my interpretation anyway.

Robocles

Kolache wrote: »

magnusnet wrote: »

I hope we don't get linear (horizontal progression) at cap. There's Guild Wars for that .

IMO, moderation is the best answer for a lot of things, including MMO progression

Shooting from the hip with a prediction, I'd imagine they're just aiming for more sustainable systems that can more accurately be measured and balanced, (unlike the current periodic level cap increase and extremely flexible stat system).

I'm sort of thinking that their mention of animation tweaking will also involve balancing animation cancelling. Not removing necessarily, just formally accounting for it/designing around it one way or another.

I may be overly optimistic, but in the end I don't think one side has to win and the other has to lose--they just need some more concrete foundations in the game to build on.

I don't disagree with you on the idea of moderation. But, they created their own issue with level cap increases. You don't increase your level cap by 20% (from initial vet 10) TWICE in a few months after launch. You create meaningful content for people to do at cap, and then maybe increase it a bit every year or so.

We shall see if this "Champion System" is any good. The "Veteran System" certainly didn't show itself to be very sustainable. And, on that topic, can you stop coming up with cutesy names for what are nominal game mechanics, ZOS?

Edit: Added that they did it twice.

bosmern_ESO

Its all going to be reverted to level 50, and there would be no reason for people to be upset over it because the armor they are using will still work as it did before, it will just have a different number on it without the veteran symbol.

Robocles

bosmern_ESO wrote: »

Its all going to be reverted to level 50, and there would be no reason for people to be upset over it because the armor they are using will still work as it did before, it will just have a different number on it without the veteran symbol.

He obviously means the stats on the armor, not the arbitrary level next to it.

Jayne_Doe

If they remove the Veteran levels, then I would guess when a person reaches level 50, they'll get 14 skill points and 14 attribute points? Remember, they added skill points and attribute points at veteran level-ups, and I'm assuming they're not going to take those away. If they did, you'd have people with 13 more skill points/attribute points than those who reach level 50 after the new system is in place.

Kraven

Robocles wrote: »

I don't disagree with you on the idea of moderation. But, they created their own issue with level cap increases. You don't increase your level cap by 20% (from initial vet 10) TWICE in a few months after launch. You create meaningful content for people to do at cap, and then maybe increase it a bit every year or so.

The problem came before launch, they made a knee jerk reaction. Vet ranks were suppose to be end game progression starting with V1 and 2 for craglorn and trials. However, so many people clamored "I want to do everything on one single character." that it was decided to just add a vet rank per zone after 50. So instead of cap at launch being 50 with Craglorn slated to add in V1-2 we started off with V10 with no where to go.

Unfortunately this was not only never fully thought out but it's affects on the content that was still in development was never considered. So we ended up with what instead of being a progression was solely a grind. With a host of 50+ issues that were never considered because the other alliances were meant to be reserved for alts. A look from a diff perspective. Silver and Gold were a poor idea and IMO some of the saddest laziest content. Kill Molag Bal now go die to a dwemer sphere in a starting zone...

Champion system seems to be a little better thought out with some actual planning put into it. So I really hope it delivers. Crafting is such a joke that no matter what they do to armor players will just craft a new set. The only item concerns being the hard to find dropped items or the pvp bag set pieces you spent hundreds of thousands of AP to get the few you actually wanted.