Dragon Leap/Take Flight onto keeps - is this intended?

curlyqloub14_ESO

I am still seeing DK's "jump" onto keep walls and ledges in Cyrodiil - places they shouldn't be able to reach. Especially from outer keep to inner keep ledges. I'm also pretty sure this is not an intended mechanic.

I thought I read somewhere that this had been addressed/fixed... am I just mistaken?

Agrippa_Invisus

You're mistaken in that it's an exploit.

curlyqloub14_ESO

Well sure, using the skill as it works is not an exploit - I get it, you're just using the tools you were given. Sorry, but I don't know how else to describe it. Using the skill to jump to places you shouldn't be able to reach is taking an unfair advantage of the layout of the keeps. I'm not blaming the skill itself (and really don't blame DKs for using it either), and not asking for it to be nerfed, but no one should be able to jump on top of keeps like this.

Agrippa_Invisus

Here's the key -- if you can't kill a handful of DKs leaping up into the keep, you have more problems than the DKs themselves.

Either there's no defense force or there's no skill in the defense force. Either way, you're in trouble.

curlyqloub14_ESO

As a matter of fact, we did kill the DKs who leapt up - still doesn't make it right, and the skill of the defense force, or lack thereof, is completely irrelevant to my point.
-
Argue with me all you want about how much I must suck at pvp, and how it's fine the way it is, but you aren't going to convince me that the devs intended for anyone to be able to do this.

Azarul

Already took away my ability to pull people off the walls. Now you want me to not be able to take the fight to them. Boy game gets more fun every minute.

curlyqloub14_ESO

No one else gets to pull people off walls or jump onto them - you are not a special snowflake. Take the fight to them with seige and ranged weapons and spells like the rest of us.

Azarul

I do not have a group heal like a templar so should they lose theirs?

Rylana

Every time I do it, I giggle like a maniac watching the defenders scatter that were being so smug and on the walls edge a few seconds before.

Nothing annoys me more than a bad players plinging away at me from a spot I cant get to.

Then I get up there...

Delicious

Columba

Lol. Who cares? I just rune them to their deaths everytime I see their wings. They fly in, hit rune fall to their death.

eventide03b14a_ESO

curlyqloub14_ESO wrote: »

As a matter of fact, we did kill the DKs who leapt up - still doesn't make it right, and the skill of the defense force, or lack thereof, is completely irrelevant to my point.
-
Argue with me all you want about how much I must suck at pvp, and how it's fine the way it is, but you aren't going to convince me that the devs intended for anyone to be able to do this.

So you killed some suicidal DK's and then decided to post on the forums how it's an exploit. Let me educate you on what an exploit is. An exploit is when you use an unintended game mechanic or bug as an advantage in game play. Let's break this down for people who keep complaining about something that is really a non-issue much less an exploit.

1. DK jumps onto wall using all of his ultimate.
2. DK is now left without any support from anyone who might heal or otherwise assist him.
3. DK now gets killed because he is outnumbered.
4. Players troll the forums crying about how unfair it is that their classes can't commit suicide by jumping into a nest of the opposing faction.

Now if the jumping DK could do this without alerting the enemy (they can't because it requires a target) or if they could somehow unlock the gate for their friends, maybe it would be something to cry about. But really, If that one DK gives you that much trouble imagine what 50 of friends are going to do when that wall comes down.

This is another case where people complain that someone can unfairly do something they can't even if it has absolutely negligible impact on gameplay. I wonder what life must be like for you people on a daily basis where people get things you don't. Where your self-entitled complaining yields no satisfaction in real life at least you can be certain that you have ruined something for others in a video game.

I don't play a DK, but I do (did) play a vampire nightblade who enjoyed the sneak stacking until a bunch cry babies whined on the forums. I get no satisfaction that they are destroying what seems like a foolish, yet fun mechanic for someone else.

Pchela

I am a NB who can ambush myself onto keeps if I find the proper spot. Is that an exploit?

curlyqloub14_ESO

Lots of angry flaming from DKs - no shock there. No matter, take your rage out on me, I don't care. You've missed my point, and that's fine, b/c I'm not really looking for answers from the general public here anyway.

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

Let me educate you on what an exploit is. An exploit is when you use an unintended game mechanic or bug as an advantage in game play.

Exactly. An UNINTENDED mechanic. I don't think the devs intended for DK to be able to jump onto keep walls. I'm not blaming the players for doing it - they should use what was given them. I'm not asking for the ability to be nerfed in any way either. But then, if people didn't get that from my earlier post, not likely they will catch it here either, b/c they are already too busy being angry about things I didn't ask for.

Just because that particular DK did die, doesn't mean they all do, and the scenario you described in your pretty little list is rather exaggerated and over-generalized.

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

I don't play a DK, but I do (did) play a vampire nightblade who enjoyed the sneak stacking until a bunch cry babies whined on the forums. I get no satisfaction that they are destroying what seems like a foolish, yet fun mechanic for someone else.

Yeah, same here. I didn't care much for that nerf either - but its a bit different scenario b/c ZoS stated more than once that the speed WAS intended.

curlyqloub14_ESO

bees83 wrote: »

I am a NB who can ambush myself onto keeps if I find the proper spot. Is that an exploit?

I'd say yeah, cuz keeps weren't meant to work that way. Again, I'm not asking for skills to be nerfed, or saying that anything is wrong with the DK ability. If anything the problem is with the Keep designs.

But just to maybe calm some nerves - I've changed the title of this thread to hopefully more accurately reflect my real question.

Agrippa_Invisus

curlyqloub14_ESO wrote: »

Exactly. An UNINTENDED mechanic. I don't think the devs intended for DK to be able to jump onto keep walls.

That's the key right there.

This is your opinion, not the dev's. If it's an exploit, they'll state it is or correct it by making it impossible. Until then, understand that it's your opinion.

curlyqloub14_ESO

I understand that it's my opinion, and it's exactly why I made this post, to (hopefully, maybe) get a "statement" from the devs.

Karamis_Vimardon

curlyqloub14_ESO wrote: »

I understand that it's my opinion, and it's exactly why I made this post, to (hopefully, maybe) get a "statement" from the devs.

This is not the forum you are looking for.

I like DKs jumping onto walls, adds a bit of flavour to the otherwise dull wall sieges Not to mention it requires the right geography, an unsuspecting enemy player, and a bit of timing to pull off. If they can recognise and utilise all three to get up top, they deserve too!

P.S. Not a DK player

Pchela

Not even gonna lie, I made a DK so I could start leaping into keeps. It looks so exciting.

smee_z

Don't mind DKs getting on to keep walls and they being able to pull off defenders from keep walls or pull raiders on the ground up to the keep wall before(put this back devs).

Also want NBs to be able to teleport strike defenders on keep walls. BTW, they can already strike and go with a defender entering doors if they time it correctly thus entering the keep.

Like one said already, it adds 'FLAVOR' to the keep sieges.

Not a DK. Not an NB. fyi.

MiyaTheUnbroken

The first time I saw it I thought it must be an unintentional side effect of the landscape, since at most keeps it's not even possible, to my knowledge at least. I reported the person and received this reply:

"Thanks for taking the time to contact us about this. We wanted to let you know that using the Dragon Leap ability on a player on keep guard to get into a keep is a valid use of the ability. Thank you for being so diligent about letting us know this happened, but we do want to let you know this is not an exploit."

As long as they aren't getting into inner without the keep even being marked I guess it's fair enough. In any event, it seems the support team is backing them, so if it troubles you just send in some feedback letting them know and move on. Not much else to do.

serenenightmare

Another thread about this? >_<

Kelces

No, this was not intended, I'd go for the rune on the wall aswell, hopefully it gets fixed sometime...

Beega

Sure is hilarious when it happens.

WarrioroftheWind_ESO

If the enemy faction has DK's that do this frequently, learn to identify them and prepare accordingly. Warn people not to make themselves easy targets. Have people slot kb's or a intercept squad at the ready. It's easy to rage at something you don't fully understand but once you begin working the more tactical approach, it's easy to turn the tables....most of the times at least.

If you cannot counter DK leaping, either you are not coordinating enough to send a response team or have them at the ready, OR...the DK is just a utter beast whose name is spoken with dread by everyone on your faction ;D

MiyaTheUnbroken

While we're on the topic, can someone clarify how take flight/dragon leap works? Are they able to do it to/towards enemies that are stealthed or invised? I had assumed not, but twice I've been the target while stealthed and hidden, and once I was invised with dark cloak. I've heard similar accounts from others, and I'm wondering if that's how it's supposed to work, or if this is part of stealth and cloak always being broken, or if there's something I'm missing entirely.

DezIsDead

Idk why all the hate. So a couple DK's can jump onto the walls of a select few keeps. There is bigger issues than this. How about lag crashes, healing springs crashes etc. I could care less about 2 DK's suiciding on my keeps. If and I mean IF they kill me I'll just Rez at the camp 2 feet away and set up a new meat bag <shrug>

Kelces

I agree, there is a big mess to fix, just basics.

But, how does this go together with the completely unnecessary task of putting new spell animations into the game, that actually started the big problems (especially in Cyrodiil)?

You can't leave homework undone, while proceeding with your hobbys and then complain about too much work.

I'm neutral on that topic in general and would even like to see every class having an ability to "sneak" their way into castles in some way. To give PvP some more "Flavor" as some put it.

Asgari

These threads are hilarious! I will continue to fly into your keeps and I will continue to bat swarm anyone who tries to defeat me in my newly claimed keep.

I .
Will.
Own.
Your.
Keep.

You were just a temporary pest ..

Allicus

DKs are the bane of my life as a NB, but I must say I am in awe (and a little bit jealous )when they leap may this ability stay as it is.

ZOS_BrianWheeler

We did a scrubbing of keeps back in patch 2 and 3 to try and limit this from occuring. Are you seeing DKs using this to get into the inner keep from the back walls still?

Maulkin

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

We did a scrubbing of keeps back in patch 2 and 3 to try and limit this from occuring. Are you seeing DKs using this to get into the inner keep from the back walls still?

I can use Ferocious Leap to get onto outer keep walls, but I've failed so far to find a way to leap into inner keeps.

That said, when I had the Take Flight morph (only 2-3 weeks back), I couldn't leap onto the outer walls. It seems like something is different on the permissible vertical angles of Take Flight.

Anyhow, if I'm reading this correctly it's OK being able to leap onto the outer walls, so long as you can't leap onto the inner walls?