Whow, you didn't really buff Shades, you nerfed them hard!

ipkonfigcub18_ESO

Group of 3 Mobs I could put the Shades on 1/3 and deal with 1/3 if the Shades aggro-ed all 3. Which ever one I hit turned to me.

Now the Shades go in and (you said you increased but I don't see a big change) and ALL 3/3 mobs turn to me as soon as I come out of sneak/stealth.

If you're going to blindside nerf abilities TELL YOUR PLAYERS IN PATCH NOTES, please.

Shades are no longer worth me sending in to groups of Mobs to stay alive. You've basically told me "3 mobs = group content only".

EDIT:
This is how the Shades "used" to work (below video). Now shades no longer keep the other 2+ mobs busy for the player to finish off the group. Once you start DPSing the 1/3 mobs the 2/3 turn to you and start fighting you as of today's patch. (undocumented in patch notes)
http://youtu.be/CngKfuVIErI

Ser Lobo

I can usually handle three mobs on my NB archer build. Four or more, I have to be creative. Crippling Grasp on one, knockback on the other, focus on the target with most effect (healer, usually, or dual wield).

Spidermonk

Unable to verify (as I'm patching) but if this is true...

Shades never were good at damage, perhaps 2% every attack (almost as useless as Lyris :P). They WERE good as a distraction to keep a mob busy while you focused elsewhere. (in combo with a mez vs 3 targets it made things workable). I also heard that the vanish is broken where the NPC's still target you.

This severely cuts down on our survivability in multi-mob fights.

ipkonfigcub18_ESO

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

NB archer build

Good lord people . . . .

Spidermonk wrote: »

Unable to verify (as I'm patching) but if this is true...

Shades never were good at damage, perhaps 2% every attack (almost as useless as Lyris :P). They WERE good as a distraction to keep a mob busy while you focused elsewhere. (in combo with a mez vs 3 targets it made things workable). I also heard that the vanish is broken where the NPC's still target you.

This severely cuts down on our survivability in multi-mob fights.

True, they're not supposed to be good on Damage, they're supposed to keep the other mobs busy and occupied. Now? They no longer do that, period.

Today's patch burned two abilities for NBs into the ground.

ZOS - I'm ok with these nerfs, but you need to help us in the Survival area BAD. Hire some folks that enjoy developing AND PLAY MELEE in your game so we can get some real fixes for our class.

Evergreen

ipkonfigcub18_ESO wrote: »

Group of 3 Mobs I could put the Shades on 1/3 and deal with 1/3 if the Shades aggro-ed all 3. Which ever one I hit turned to me.

Now the Shades go in and (you said you increased but I don't see a big change) and ALL 3/3 mobs turn to me as soon as I come out of sneak/stealth.

If you're going to blindside nerf abilities TELL YOUR PLAYERS IN PATCH NOTES, please.

Shades are no longer worth me sending in to groups of Mobs to stay alive. You've basically told me "3 mobs = group content only".

This has to be an mmo history first where the class that needed to be fixed the most gets the hardest nerfs instead.

fenweeneb18_ESO

All those undocumented nerfs, modifying skills that didn't need to be modified yet not fixing those that obviously need it.. The game was enjoyable but it is definitly taking a turn for the worst.. They change things, do not tell you about it and won't refund your skill-points even when they say they will.. They developed a great game, and are destroying it so fast..

ipkonfigcub18_ESO

fenweeneb18_ESO wrote: »

All those undocumented nerfs, modifying skills that didn't need to be modified yet not fixing those that obviously need it.. The game was enjoyable but it is definitly taking a turn for the worst.. They change things, do not tell you about it and won't refund your skill-points even when they say they will.. They developed a great game, and are destroying it so fast..

Yep. And now when I hit V10 I'm pretty much done with the game. Forced group questing is about the dumbest thing I have ever seen come to a game. I enjoy soloing and grouping up for dungeons only. I like helping people, grouping and such, but forcing me to group to quest in an entire zone? Pff.

But yes to ignore the NB issues over and over and over in this game by the Ranged Player Base Developers has come to its end with me. If this is how these developers are going to favor the classes in this game, I see no reason to continue on after V10.

It can only get worse until they hire folks that enjoy playing melee classes in their own game.

ipkonfigcub18_ESO

Added video to the original post showing how the Shades used to work in the game.

ipkonfigcub18_ESO

I currently am doing a quest where an NPC is following me around helping. So because Shades are completely useless in the game, I switched to Agony to Stun one of the mobs for 12sec.

Guess what happens? The NPC that's with me goes in and attacks the one I stunned.

What
The
Hell
Is
Wrong
With
You
Zenimax



Can't win with you, Zenimax. You truly, truly despise and hate Melee in your game with a passion.

czar

i didn't get my hopes up for nb in this patch but this is worse than i thought

ipkonfigcub18_ESO

schip wrote: »

i didn't get my hopes up for nb in this patch but this is worse than i thought

What's worse is we had to wait for all these so called fixes for NBs for a long time. Could have used them a long time ago - no we had to wait and wait. Then we get slammed with these undocumented changes along with nerfs.

If what I'm posting about is a bug, you can bet it'll be months before this company figures it out and reads the forums to address the issue.

I have a very large feeling that NBs, in their mind, would not be a popular class (aside from the fact no real thought went into its combat system).

I think NBs are finally done in this game. Yes, let's adjust he mob AI in the game, nerf NBs more (we were already nerfed with riddled bugs) and do some undocumented nerfing while we're at it. Totally makes sense.

This is why Blizzard keeps dominating the gaming industry and their games suck. How is that even possible in 2014....

Fl0g

Evergreen wrote: »

This has to be an mmo history first where the class that needed to be fixed the most gets the hardest nerfs instead.

You would think it would be rare but it has happened a lot. It's exactly what happens when a game doesn't have strict development parameters, regressive testing, and then nerfs according to committee.

rawne1980b16_ESO

But the shade still appears.

This is obviously an oversight and must be nerfed at once.

Lord_Hev

Oh gods this is bad. It's like Murphy's law, but amplified for the lolz.


I can imagine the flood of bug reports now... They better get their act together because this is getting ridiculous...

shinkicker444rwb17_ESO

I used to play that way with Shades, I kinda liked the style but they were to weak and limiting, so I ended up dropping the skill. Before the patch I could successfully repeatedly stealth stunlock a group of 3 and only take ~25% damage - although sometimes things would go *** up and I'd come out with like 10% or die (couldn't do that at the start of VR content, it was Shades or bust then). Post patch, I'm kind of doubtful I will be able to do that with the way HP and Damage has been buffed on VR mobs.

binaryAegis

This may not have been documented in the patch notes but I am sure that people from the pts had said that they were no longer targetable weeks ago.

IMO Summon Shade (and its morphs) has always struck me as being more of a boss tanking ability with its built in 15% damage reduction debuff that it places on whatever mob it is attacking.

All in all I'm not bothered by this change, especially since you can also look at it from the perspective that you don't have to worry about them getting killed by AoE attacks like Sorc Pets.

bg22

I just don't see how such a large company can consist of developers whom all LOVE cloth casters, and HATE melee players entirely. Is that a application question?

Hire some diversity... We need some melee love FFS!

Ps. Those are all what should be hot-fixes... Not "upcoming content". Wtf is wrong w/ this picture?

bg22

In other words... Awesome. Putting my VR 10 nightblade on a shelf tn to collect dust... Time to roll a new "main" until I decide to cancel my sub.

Bloodless

I have the summon two shades nerf and if I cast it too far away only one shade runs to the target then when that shade engages the target the second shade runs to the target but by the time it gets there already 4-7 seconds have passed.

summon shade lowest damaging useless "DoT" ever.

moXrox

ipkonfigcub18_ESO wrote: »

Group of 3 Mobs I could put the Shades on 1/3 and deal with 1/3 if the Shades aggro-ed all 3. Which ever one I hit turned to me.

Now the Shades go in and (you said you increased but I don't see a big change) and ALL 3/3 mobs turn to me as soon as I come out of sneak/stealth.

If you're going to blindside nerf abilities TELL YOUR PLAYERS IN PATCH NOTES, please.

Shades are no longer worth me sending in to groups of Mobs to stay alive. You've basically told me "3 mobs = group content only".

EDIT:
This is how the Shades "used" to work (below video). Now shades no longer keep the other 2+ mobs busy for the player to finish off the group. Once you start DPSing the 1/3 mobs the 2/3 turn to you and start fighting you as of today's patch. (undocumented in patch notes)
http://youtu.be/CngKfuVIErI

WTF.....is this a joke.

This is like hitting target dummies only.

Even as a lvl 10 the combat is more difficult and exciting.

Phaedryn

Fl0g wrote: »

Evergreen wrote: »

This has to be an mmo history first where the class that needed to be fixed the most gets the hardest nerfs instead.

You would think it would be rare but it has happened a lot. It's exactly what happens when a game doesn't have strict development parameters, regressive testing, and then nerfs according to committee.

Agreed. Horrible design decisions coupled with sub par QC and this is what you get.

Junkogen

Did you report the bug already? Any response?

elwhy

Cydogg wrote: »

This may not have been documented in the patch notes but I am sure that people from the pts had said that they were no longer targetable weeks ago.

IMO Summon Shade (and its morphs) has always struck me as being more of a boss tanking ability with its built in 15% damage reduction debuff that it places on whatever mob it is attacking.

All in all I'm not bothered by this change, especially since you can also look at it from the perspective that you don't have to worry about them getting killed by AoE attacks like Sorc Pets.

If the idea of summoning a shade was just to knock down an enemy's damage percent, then why summon a shade at all? Why not just cast something? I'm not arguing with you, because this could be Zenimax's purpose, but if they're going to send a shade at someone then it should capture the target's attention (like it did before). This is such a ridiculous/stupid change.

shamsb14a_ESO

ipkonfigcub18_ESO wrote: »

I currently am doing a quest where an NPC is following me around helping. So because Shades are completely useless in the game, I switched to Agony to Stun one of the mobs for 12sec.

Guess what happens? The NPC that's with me goes in and attacks the one I stunned.

Pets and companion NPCs are brain-dead in this game. I have the same problem with sorc pets pulling random mobs, attacking the CC'd mob, or just standing there doing nothing while I fight. It's so bad w/ sorc pets that you don't dare bring them out in group content or they'll run around and agro the whole damned place.

OkieDokie

I'm sorry, but I really want to know..What's the addon you're using for combat? The one displaying damage?

wrlifeboil

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

I can usually handle three mobs on my NB archer build. Four or more, I have to be creative. Crippling Grasp on one, knockback on the other, focus on the target with most effect (healer, usually, or dual wield).

This only works when the keys you press actually trigger the command. I often have to double hit a key to get a nightblade command to trigger. Oddly, this doesn't happen when I play my dk.

ipkonfigcub18_ESO

wrlifeboil wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

I can usually handle three mobs on my NB archer build. Four or more, I have to be creative. Crippling Grasp on one, knockback on the other, focus on the target with most effect (healer, usually, or dual wield).

This only works when the keys you press actually trigger the command. I often have to double hit a key to get a nightblade command to trigger. Oddly, this doesn't happen when I play my dk.

ya the amount of broken issues with Nightblades and the total neglect by Zenimax is probably the worst I have ever seen by a gaming company.

I have to spam keys just to ensure my abilities go off. I feel like I'm in WoW

ipkonfigcub18_ESO

OkieDokie wrote: »

I'm sorry, but I really want to know..What's the addon you're using for combat? The one displaying damage?

http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info281-CombatCloud.html

ipkonfigcub18_ESO

Junkogen wrote: »

Did you report the bug already? Any response?

Any nightblade bugs reported in this game end up in China....

ipkonfigcub18_ESO

shinkicker444rwb17_ESO wrote: »

I used to play that way with Shades, I kinda liked the style but they were to weak and limiting, so I ended up dropping the skill. Before the patch I could successfully repeatedly stealth stunlock a group of 3 and only take ~25% damage - although sometimes things would go *** up and I'd come out with like 10% or die (couldn't do that at the start of VR content, it was Shades or bust then). Post patch, I'm kind of doubtful I will be able to do that with the way HP and Damage has been buffed on VR mobs.

Well the Shades should never to tons of damage, they're an assistance to the Nightblade DW setup. It's very costly for us to restealth over and over to restun mobs. Though tonight the mobs do an insane amount more damage making 3 mobs for a Nightblade beyond difficult. The Shades helped assist us with this - now no longer do. When I switched to the next mob the Shades had done pretty much no damage.

And they're not tanks by any means, they can die easily so I have to be careful. They're not pets either, they're only out for 20+ seconds and I only use them on large pulls -because I'm in leather, I cannot take the damage of 3 mobs that easily.

After every fight with 2+ mobs I feel like Jack on "Lost"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJ2AHDmSI_g&t=0m7s

wrlifeboil

ipkonfigcub18_ESO wrote: »

wrlifeboil wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

I can usually handle three mobs on my NB archer build. Four or more, I have to be creative. Crippling Grasp on one, knockback on the other, focus on the target with most effect (healer, usually, or dual wield).

This only works when the keys you press actually trigger the command. I often have to double hit a key to get a nightblade command to trigger. Oddly, this doesn't happen when I play my dk.

ya the amount of broken issues with Nightblades and the total neglect by Zenimax is probably the worst I have ever seen by a gaming company.

I have to spam keys just to ensure my abilities go off. I feel like I'm in WoW

You must have played WoW from a foreign country. Eso response to keystrokes seems worse than it was in BC.